Okay so perhaps yesterday’s Game Thread was somewhat unnecessarily dark and kitten-laden. Apparently all it takes is a little season-ending to get the Reds moving again.

It’s 1961 Throwback Day. Brian Erts has the what’s-up on all that. The different colored sleeves remind me the late 90s-early 2000 unis, only without the hideously unnecessary black accents. Here’s Frank Robinson, NL MVP that year, rocking his Topps.


This was the look of the Ragamuffin Reds, the outta-nowhere team who shocked the division by winning it.


I know, don’t start.

Starting Pitchers

A DeSclafani (R)  4.29 1.32 92.1 94 5 4
 J Flaherty (R) 4.41 1.20 104.0 115 4 6


Oh Disco, what you gonna do?


This Flaherty fellow brings the Battle of The Mediocre Pitchers. Settle in, kids.

Starting Lineups


  1. J Winker (L) CF
  2. J Votto (L) 1B
  3. E Suárez (R) 3B
  4. Y Puig (R) RF
  5. J VanMeter (L) LF
  6. S Gennett (L) 2B
  7. J Peraza (R) SS
  8. A DeSclafani (R) P
  9. R Lavarnway (R) C


  1. T Edman (S) 2B
  2. D Fowler (S) RF
  3. R Ravelo (R) 1B
  4. T O’Neill (R) LF
  5. P DeJong (R) SS
  6. Y Muñoz (R) 3B
  7. A Knizner (R) C
  8. H Bader (R) CF
  9. J Flaherty (R) P

News and Notes

Lavarnway has returned to the lineup (and is batting 9th) and so has VanMeter. Let’s hear it for the new and hungry members of the litter.

-I’d like to congratulate both teams on getting the lineups in before I had to leave for Mass this morning. Nice work, good prioritizing, excellent use of day planner.

– The McAlpin’s Fashion Show on Ruler Day must have resulted in a straight-up riot at the Crosely turnstyles.

Ms. Ashely‘s got you for the upcoming Brewers series. I hope to see you at Game Day Therapy. I enjoyed experiencing the apocoplyse with you.

104 Responses

  1. Sliotar

    A friend joked that I should pass on this game, that the Reds never win on Sunday.

    Looked it up …..

    This season –

    4-12 on Sundays
    13-28 in all day games

    What in the world? Those are quite the outliers.

    Go Redlegs.

    • Mike Adams

      The Reds have lost 3 out of the last 4 Sundays, so maybe they are due.

  2. VaRedsFan

    Good for JVM getting another start. Now if he wants more than a foot in the door, he really needs to rise to the occasion for a 2nd straight day. It might not be fair, but that’s the way it is….sink or swim

    • docproc

      And swim hard and fast before the league gets a book on you.

  3. daytonnati

    I hate to be “that guy”, but … “This was the look of the Ragamuffin Reds, the outta-nowhere team who shocked the division by winning it.”

    There were no divisions in 1961. Still just two leagues, 8 teams in the National, 10 in the American. NL expansion was in 1962, the Mets and Colt 45s, bringing the number of MLB franchises to 20. I don’t believe there were divisions until 1969?

  4. Seat101

    Is there anyone who hasn’t read the uniform write up today? They’re wonderful every week but particularly good this week

    @thatguy Sometimes you just Gotta get it out of your system

    I had that ruler in until 2002. I have no idea what happened to it it just disappeared one day.

    We’ve got the A-Team starting today. We should take this game 10 to 2 at least

  5. vegastypo

    I’ve got one of those rulers — maybe a year or two later. Need to dig that up, maybe post a photo of it somewhere …

    • ToBeDetermined

      Ruler day.
      I missed it. 🙁
      Actually, that would be something useful, rather than a bobblehead. What can you do with a bobblehead ?
      The Bobblehead – I’d bill it as the nick nack for guys. The advertising agency that came up with that one is got to be rolling in the $.

    • Mary Beth Ellis

      I wonder what they’re going for on eBay?
      You know they’re there.

  6. VaRedsFan

    If the Reds can turn this 2 outcome AB’s to 3 outcome AB’s…they’ll be in business.

    • doofus

      Who is “Hom?” Do you mean Hom Solo, Han’s little brother?

      • doofus

        My mistake, you addressing “tHom” solo.

      • Joe Farfsing

        #ShutUptHom is an old twitter hashtag used when the undeservingly smug and negative Jr Mr Brennaman gets on a soapbox about something ridiculous and unnecessary

  7. Pete

    Really tough luck for Disco. DP would be nice…

  8. Hot Chili

    Why pitching to Bader with 1b open and the pitcher hitting next? Of course, Suarez made it worst.

  9. Pete

    Yesterday we see why the Reds are not a bad team, today we see why the have a bad record. Yesterday’s game was near flawless. Today’s not so much, only 2 outs in the second inning.

  10. Pete

    Not his fault but Jesse Winker should never play CF unless under the direst of circumstances.

      • Pete

        Peraza, VanMeter and Ervin would be an upgrade because of foot speed if nothing else. CF may be the most important defensive position on the field. Jesse is too slow, nothing he can do about it, none of the other three are CF’s either but each would be better.

    • LWblogger2

      I’ve asked Davud Bell why he feels that Winker in CF and Ervin in LF is a better alignment than Ervin in CF and Winker in LF. Asked before the game Friday. No answer as of yet.

  11. doofus

    A REAL centerfielder would have caught that ball. Really?! Jesse Winker in CF? This front office is totally inept!

  12. Seat101

    I am glad I did not go to the game today. It’s nearly an hour since the game started and we’re in the top of the third.Sometimes it seems impossible for me to drink enough water. I’d have to spend a couple of innings in the cool center

    After the Reds back in the third I’m gonna head to the pool and check in on game day and of course at Redlegnation.com

    It looks like the picture knows they’re not swing at the first pitch and he’s Groovin them down the middle

    Any uniform that doesn’t have a ton of black in it i like for the Reds

  13. Slicc50

    Come on fellas! Need this one today! Flaherty 20 homers allowed in 104 ip. He is hittable!

  14. VaRedsFan

    I really like Votto’s new stance…I think results are going to start to improve for him.

    • Pete

      That swing did remind me of Votto before this year, he really tagged that ball.

      First and second in 2 of 3 innings, next time let’s put up some runs.

  15. Seat101

    Enough about the Hall of Fame. Let’s talk about the Reds on base

  16. Pete

    Okay, let’s make hay while the sun’s shining, 1st and 3rd no outs.

  17. Slicc50

    This dude has some awesome numbers. 45 ip. Only 8 walks with 63 strikeouts

  18. Slicc50

    These guys can’t get a run for anything can they? It’s up to Scooter now!

  19. RedAlert

    Epic fail – par for the course with this bunch

  20. Pete

    Bases loaded, no outs, and 4,5 and 6 hitters up; and nada. Wow.

  21. VaRedsFan

    Peraza hosed on 2 outside pitches this game.

  22. Rich H

    Peraza got jobbed by the umpire on both of those called strikeouts. Can’t remember the last time he struck out looking twice in a game.

  23. Preach

    At least Lavarnway put it in play. Baby steps……

  24. VaRedsFan

    That ball was hit 5 miles high and Winker still couldn’t run under it. Fox camera work is the worst.

    • Burtgummer

      Convenient how you ignore the fact the ball hit the wall well over his head nothing wrong with complaining on a message board but don’t make things up

      • VaRedsFan

        Luckily, i was able to rewind it so I could confirm or deny your claim. The wall in front of the bullpen is not high, and it hit a at the base of the yellow line (call it 7-8 feet). I’m not saying Winker can make that play, but I am saying 90% of all the other cf’ers do. So check your story before you accuse people of making stuff up.

      • Burtgummer

        Oh please I also rewound before I posted
        Just another lie I need to remember your nic so I know not to believe anything you post

      • ToBeDetermined

        Come on Reds. Do you see what your causing with this unacceptable play. There is becoming disharmony among the commentators to Redlegnation.

    • Burtgummer

      You’re first week watching baseball?

      • VaRedsFan

        Duck the facts and attack…nice rebuttal.

    • Burtgummer

      Lol ducking the facts ?? I’ve already busted you for lying but I’m ducking the facts
      Hopefully people see this and reality see kind of a person you really are
      Have a good day

      • Pete

        It’s a difference of opinion – you guys disagree – neither are liars from what I’ve seen. The team’s tanking and it’s frustrating, this is the problem. People tend to get edgy.

      • VaRedsFan

        You attempted to bust me…and failed once the facts were presented. Go troll another site newbie, we don’t do that here.

  25. C Holbert

    Unless Senzel is really hurt and cannot play, I am not sure why JVMR is not playing second, he is taking ABs from Senzel. If they truly are going to play him and give him his opportunities, he should be playing instead of Gennett. He cannot do worse than Scooter or DD, currently. His Reds future is not in the outfield..

    • LWblogger2

      And if Senzel was that hurt he should have been put on the IL. Reds go with 13 pitchers so you can’t keep a guy on the bench that is banged up enough that he couldn’t start for more than 3-4 games.

    • Roger Garrett

      Yep but this is the Reds.Vets play and we platoon younger guys if they play at all.It won’t change until the front office dictates.Vets never lose their job or at least position players don’t.Senzel was given a job because he was blocked,yeah I know,so he doesn’t count.Maybe the young guys aren’t good enough,maybe they are good enough but we haven’t found out and won’t.

  26. VaRedsFan

    No Ervin for Winker to lead off vs. the lefty….and more importantly defense

  27. VaRedsFan

    Wouldn’t have minded another inning by Sims in the 8th.

  28. LWblogger2

    I have generally been supportive of this team and its management this year but some serious questions now. I’m really not sure what to think or what the answer may be.

    • RedAlert

      Sell everything and anything at the deadline – not even out of July and season over AGAIN ! The losing culture in this
      organization from top to bottom and in between is just unbelievable .

  29. Ldog

    Has Votto choked up on the bat more this season? Or has he gone to a smaller one? He looks like a Punch and Judy hitter now, Or maybe trying to do a Pete Rose thing…..minus the success and intensity of course. Back in the day, Votto’s swing was a thing of beauty.

    • VaRedsFan

      Actually, starting a game or so ago…he changed is stance and choked up less. He really looked solid in his last few ABs (before Miller)

      • ToBeDetermined

        I didn’t see it, but Miller is really tough on Lefties. He has those long arms and throws from kind of three quarters of the way down delivery.

  30. LWblogger2

    One thing is certain,this team isn’t winning in 2019 so if Puig isn’t taking an offer for an extension or they don’t plan on offering him one, they need to trade him soon. Roark should be moved as well.

    • VaRedsFan

      I was on the extend Puig train for awhile, but I don’t know now. He doesn’t hit anything unless its a low fastball, middle in. I love his intensity and defense.

      • Pete

        We can sign him back in the off season. I’d like to see Ervin and then Aquino in RF. For all the hoopla, Yasiel has a wRC+ of 101 good for 22nd place in qualifying RF. Defensive WAR of -3.2, total WAR of 1.1. Chances have to be fair Ervin could give us those numbers and also quite possible Aquino as well.

        Hate to say, I’m ducking, but I believe YP is overrated because he is fun to watch.

      • VaRedsFan

        fair point about being fun to watch.

        Did you use to post a few years back as CharlotteNCRedsFan, or something to that effect?

      • Pete

        Yes I did. Been gone for about 4 years. Nice to see so many regulars here. VA, really enjoy your comments and style even though we don’t always agree. Nice call on Votto, he looks different today.

      • VaRedsFan

        Thought so…welcome back…we can debate civilly.

      • ToBeDetermined

        Wow you must have quite a memory and the ability to connect the dots.

  31. Preach

    Glad to see Scooter taken down here

    • Pete

      I have to believe he will get his day. Impressive ballplayer.

      • Roger Garrett

        Nope vets play and young guys platoon if they play at all.Always been that way that’s why the vets we have nobody wants.Keep em too long and then because of salary or performance or both we get nothing in return.Position players mostly of course.

      • Pete

        We’ll see, I understand your point but without hope I’m back to just watching baseball in general. I won’t watch garbage even if they are my team and always will be. Roger, I think they need a shakeup from top to bottom in this organization, bring in some outside blood and turn over the operations to the new crew.

  32. Mutton Lettuce Tomato

    This team is about to hit a new level of implosion and Thom is talking about “walk up music”.

    • Pete

      It’s not horrible to bottom out, looking at it objectively. Really it’s now time to focus on the future. If Puig and Roark aren’t coming back, they should be moved to get what value the Reds can.

      But it’s never fun to lose. I look at it as sacrificing the present for the future good.

      • ToBeDetermined

        I agree with what I think your saying, which is if they are going to be out of it, it’s best to be out of it just BEFORE the trade deadline rather than just AFTER it.
        I remember a few times years ago when a few players would put on a surge the few weeks before the trade deadline and the Reds stood pat with those players and then the trade deadline passed and they went back into their respective slumps.

  33. Mutton Lettuce Tomato

    It sure looks like pitchers have no fear whatsoever of Joey Votto anymore. Then again, I’ve never seen him take so many called third strikes in his career, so it’s probably a related item.

    • Pete

      If JV can stabilize, he still has value but it’s very difficult if he is fighting time.

      • ToBeDetermined

        JV does have value. But it’s just not going to be value to how much he is currently paid.
        His best days are behind him when he wasn’t paid as much.

        Kind of reminds me of Todd Helton first-baseman with the Rockies. He was such a good hitter for so many years when the Rockies couldn’t make the playoffs. Then (I believe it was Helton’s last year, but I may be wrong) that the Rockies went to the world series.
        Helton was certainly not the star of that team. But, I’m sure he made some contributions

  34. Aaron B.

    Ah how I wish we could post Youtube clips here, as right now the front office needs to be like Mortimer in Trading Places “Sell! Sell! Sell!” The team is officially dead in the water. They were definitely more entertaining this season then the past few dreadful ones, but it is time to be realistic and flip some pieces to get younger.

    • ToBeDetermined

      I think it’s actually better without the clip. In my minds eye, I can see the Front Office doing as you perfectly described.

  35. FreeHouse

    Things the Reds have been good at this season. Anemic offense, one run losses, blowing big leads, wasting good pitching and ofcourse the bases loaded blues.

    • ToBeDetermined

      Things the Reds haven’t done well this year. Starting pitchers that keep them in ball games, relief pitching that is historically bad, pitchers giving up the most home runs in the majors.

      • ToBeDetermined

        oops – Starting pitches that don’t keep them in ball games

  36. rex

    what kind of trade value is left in Thom?

    • ToBeDetermined

      I think he’d have to be DFA’d.

  37. burtgummer

    IF I figured right if the Reds go 28-37 the rest of the way it’ll be yet another 90 loss season in a year that ownership declared “The rebuild is over and the Reds are ready to contend”

    • George

      You are expecting the Reds to play .500 ball the rest of the way to meet the 90 loss goal. My thinking is that the Reds can exceed that and lose 95+ games. If they trade Tanner and Puig because they have nothing anywhere in AAA to replace them.

  38. ToBeDetermined


    Did ownership actually say ” The rebuild is over and the Reds are ready to contend” ?

    or was it more like (paraphrasing here) “The tanking is over and we are going to put a competitive team on the field”

    • burtgummer

      I could’ve sworn he said that but I couldn’t find it with google or bing
      So I must’ve imagined it or misinterpreted something
      So I will lay off the complaining about him for now
      Next year will really show the fans how he feels about the team.With all the guys that are leaving he will need to shell out the cash to avoid a real disaster season next year

  39. Hot Chili

    At some point the players have to be held responsible. The FO promised to “get the pitching” and they did get one of the best staff in the league. They brought analytical personnel and some of the most touted coaches in the game in Johnson and Ward. They even brought Puig to solidified an already alledgedly good offense and Iglesias and Dietrich to make for a better bench.
    Now, they are not/cannot be responsible for an anemic offense, terrible baserunning and dumb playing from players that are supposed to be a lot better than this, especially the so called “veterans”.
    It’s time for a clean house, rebuild or whatever.