The Short Version: The Reds lost. Again. Whatever.

Final R H E
Cincinnati Reds (59-80) 3 6 0
Pittsburgh Pirates (68-71) 7 12 1
W: Musgrove (6-8) L: Reed (0-2)
FanGraphs Win Probability | Box Score

The Good
–Scooter Gennett hit two home runs. He now has 22 homers on the year. That’s good.

–Matt Wisler struck out two hitters in one shutout inning. That’s good.

–Scott Schebler had a couple of singles. I guess that’s pretty good.

The Bad
–Cody Reed: five innings, six runs allowed on nine hits and a walk. That’s bad.

Not-So-Random Thoughts
–The Reds must win their 23 remaining games in order to secure a winning record. The Reds must go 14-9 the rest of the way to avoid their fourth consecutive 90+ loss season.

I’m exhausted.

The Reds have their very own mini-Steinbrenner.

Today’s Tweets

48 Responses

  1. kmartin

    I admit that I thought the season Gennett had last year was a total fluke. I was certainly wrong about this guy. He just keeps hitting.

    I still think Schebler should be moved up in the order.

    • Aaron Bradley

      Scooter loves playing for the Reds,

  2. WVRedlegs

    The Reds have to surpass the Pirates before they can focus on the other 3 teams in the division. With Pittsburgh having Taillon, Archer, and Musgrove to lead their rotation, it is going to be near impossible to overtake them next year. Not without some major changes this winter. Reds are 4-11 against Pittsburgh so far. Pitiful.
    Big changes need to happen. Big changes.

    • WVRedlegs

      And Pirates starter Trevor Williams leads the ML in 2nd half ERA at 0.75.
      That should be incentive enough for the Reds front office to bring Thor and his hammer to Cincinnati. And a reliable LH starter. Spend some hoarded up prospect capital will you.

  3. Sliotar

    From the Mahle/Homer tweet…Homer being out there to the detriment of youngsters.

    Translation – He will get his starts next season, y’all. No DFA, no bullpen…no sir.

    And, Scooter?

    If he wins the batting title, it will be the most anonymous winner in recent history.
    No one cares about him around MLB. No one wants his inflated offense and crappy defense.

    And, I read in the game thread, we should extend him now through 2022 or 2023.


    Yes…let’s add another 30 and over guy to Votto, Suarez, Schebler, Barnhart, Ervin, (Hamilton? Please no.) to be around in 2021-2022 when this team should be in the peak of its window.

    I am exhausted too, Chad…exhausted from the great established “keepers” this team has somehow guiding Reds to a fourth-straight 90-loss season.

    • Indy Red Man

      Yeah…Scooter is terrible. Nobody could use him in the AL where they have the DH. Cmon man? I’m sure you’re rooting against the Cincy boy to win the batting title too? I like to throw shade too, but I reserve it for people that actually suck like Homer or Billy at the plate. I feel like I’ve had to eat some of it w/Peraza at times. You have a buffet of crow to eat….so get at it!!!

      I will go over this again. Scooter is 28 years old!!! 28!!!! The haters act like he’s Ben Zobrist?? If they signed him to a 4 year deal with a Homer style buyout for 2022, then he’s only locked up until age 31. Is that over the hill now?

      • Steve Mancuso

        Gennett is under Reds control next year. That’s his age 29 season. An extension would start in his age 30 season in 2020. You’re proposing a contract in 2020 and 2021 with an option for 2022, assuming Gennett would agree to such a deal or that the Reds could limit their owner’s appetite to that duration.

        How would you feel if the actual contract was longer?

      • Indy Red Man

        Honestly…I crunch numbers at work but I hate the contract/salary aspects of sports. When they resign guys…don’t they wipe out the old contract for 2019 and write it into the new one so they can get an immediate raise? If you’re starting with 2020 then I’m only going 3 years. Daniel Murphy and Chase Utley scare me. Murphy can barely move and Utley dropped off pretty big around 33 I think? Scooter has a long swing and doesn’t strike me as a Ben Zobrist obp type of guy. Scooter wants the whole enchilada when he gets up to the plate!!

      • Steve Mancuso

        If they reach a deal with Scooter this off-season, they’ll include 2019 for sure. The dollar amount will be pretty close to what they estimate the arbitration award would be, maybe a little more or less. Homer Bailey took at least a half-million less for his Arb3 year in his deal, for example.

        It’s not that Scooter scares me particularly – no more so than other players his age and profile – but the Reds can’t afford to stockpile players at a certain position and they haven’t lifted a finger to see if either Gennett or Senzel plays the OF. If I were the Reds, I’d be shopping Gennett hard (maybe they have been) to make room for Senzel. Win-win.

      • Old-school

        I can’t see any team giving the Reds a major league ready elite pitching prospect .

        Zach Wheeler is at 1.9 mil in salary. He’s at 3.7 WAR and 160 innings and counting. He has one year remaining….just as Scooter.

        How ‘ bout Scooter’s one year and Keury Mella for 1 year of Wheeler and maybe more.

  4. Matt Hendley

    I hate to say it…but there is a point. Its not like its kershaw kershaw kershaw bailey and kershaw. Castillo shown vast improvement and disco is reliable when healthy but the rest of the opening day starting 5 are gone. I want him gone like the rest but i understand the unwillingness to walk away from the money (which was conveniently ommited from the quote) as reasoning to give him more starts

  5. D Ray White

    Better to play the young dudes and try to nail down the #5 pick.

    • Sasha09

      Why? Like everthing else most of the time the players they draft don’t work out anyway. Who cares what pick they get? I get tired of hearing it.

      • Jim Walker

        I’m not sure what the Reds could have done differently but I wonder if any other org picking in the top 5 in consecutive seasons has both those number 1’s out for the season with issues that could spill on over into 2019 or even beyond. Then go back another year or so and there is Tyler Stephenson who’s development was degraded by significant injuries in his 1st two seasons also.

  6. Scott Gennett

    Not sure how long they’ll continue dealing with failed prospects, time to get rid of the dirty clothes and start over. Only Disco, Castillo and maybe Mahle are set for next season starting rotation, everybody else should be heading to the bullpen, traded or DFA’d.

    • Jeff Reed

      Yes, pitching prospect time is winding down and it’s time to turn the page with next year on the horizon. With the acquisition of a solid starting pitcher, the rotation for 2019 can be average with Disco, Castillo, Mahle and Sims. Everyone else to the bullpen, traded or let go. Enough of the so-called rebuild. Return to the old way of farm system and trades and that includes the trading of prospects. Fans will again return to the ballpark only when there’s an established team on the field.

      • greenmtred

        Sims had two impressive innings, and I certainly hope that he becomes a solid starter, but it’s pretty early to pencil him in to the rotation.

    • Jim Walker

      Mahle did not set the world on fire at AAA after he went down. His FIP was 4.95; his BB/9 was 3.34; his K/9 just above 6. Those are AAA numbers. He’s younger and may come around; but, for whatever reason, he seems not to be as good a pitcher right now as he was this time last year.

  7. davemoorewvu

    I just wish Homer would’ve been healthy all year.. I think he would have a legit chance at 20 losses! That doesn’t happen every year!

  8. msanmoore

    +1 million for the mini-Steinbrener thought

  9. Scotly50

    I have stopped watching the Reds, except for when they pitch a rookie or Reed. I am here for the recaps.

    I want to thank the guys that write up this debacle night after night.

    • Colorado Red

      I still watch them on and off.
      Can’t help it.
      Been a fan since 1970, so, I am not logical on this issue.

  10. Mason Red

    Get ready folks. Next season will be the same. The FO will stick with the pitching “prospects” and the same arguments will continue. I don’t think this franchise is interested in winning because success is expensive. The Reds have bought into the Bengals business model. Lose on a regular basis with the occasional winning season that keeps the fans interested. And always always say the future is bright.

    • Jim Walker

      I think maybe you give both orgs too much credit. I believe they both are owned and operated by families that understand dollars and cents at the board room level but don’t understand the nuts and bolts aspects of how their businesses need to organize and operate on the production floor.

      Worse yet don’t realize what they don’t understand and thus are unwilling to hire competent personnel to run those parts of the business and then get out of the way to let them do it.

      • Mason Red

        Basically what I meant to say was it isn’t about winning or losing. It’s about making money with little actual investment. It’s bare bones business. Winning is an accident. It isn’t “planned”. And if they do happen to get it right the success never lasts for long. Meanwhile I also happen to believe that Cincinnati sports fans are some of the best in the country. They continue to support both teams to a certain degree and still hope things will change. But they’re not going to IMO.

  11. Show Triple Slash

    I was a Bengals season ticket holder until 2002. Driven largely by the Bengals’ ownership performance and what I believed that portended for the future, I gave up and walked away and have not looked back; history has demonstrated that was a prudent decision for me. I have great affection for the Reds’ players; the owner’s operating practices, not so much. While I was more than a little unhappy with the hanging on to Frazier and Chapman so Bob could have his All-Star Game party the way he wanted it, to the detriment of the team’s future competitiveness, I was willing to put that in the past. If, however, such is not just the past, but the (at least short-term) future, there may be a second walking away for me. Though of course not a tragedy, it would be disappointing to lose something I’ve had since the days of The Big Red Machine. I wish I could be confident that notice would be taken that I am not alone.

    • Tom Mitsoff

      Triple Slash, I too date back to the Big Red Machine days, and was a former Bengals season ticket holder. The only reason we cancelled the Bengals tickets is because I had to move out of town for work reasons. Now living in Wisconsin, I get the package for Reds games and NFL Sunday Ticket for Bengals games. At the end of a season like this baseball season, it’s not uncommon to get worn down at the end. It’s very frustrating when there is dysfunction at the top, as seems to be the case for the Reds. Hope will certainly spring eternal in the spring, even if Dick Williams and staff aren’t allowed to do what is necessary this off-season to take the next steps toward contention. Everyone here loves the Reds, so take comfort in that you are not alone, that you have a place to visit where you can be among those like yourself who take it a bit personally when the Reds lose, and where you can blow off some steam or frustration — while you wait for the next “good Reds team.” 😉

      • Jim Walker

        Words well spoken Tom. However those of us maybe 10-15 years further down the road than you, realize time is probably no longer on our side. My dad passed in 2004 having experienced the 1939-40 teams as a kid of 10-12, the ’61 team as a young father with sons of the same age as he 21 years prior, the BRM era with those sons contemporaries of the guys on the field then the 90 and 99 teams as he approached his sunset years. Even a run such as 2010-13 sometime in the next 5-7 years would be a great parting gift for many of us.

      • greenmtred

        Well said, Jim. I have the same thoughts. They’d have to a number of stupendous things to win the WS in my probable years on the old coil.

      • Colorado Red

        With ya there TOM.
        I gave up on the Bengals in the late 90’s, and switch to the Broncos.
        The big difference, we at least the Reds wanted to win.
        I do think Big Bob wants to win, but does not really know how.
        The Bengals not so much.
        Most all my friends are Rockies fans, and having a good time.
        My concern, is I do not know how long it is until the next good Reds team.
        It may be a long time

  12. Bill j

    I have been a Reds fan since the late 40s, but the stupidity of of the last few seasons have been the worst. At my age I have no hopes of seeing the Reds being good agsin.

  13. Indy Red Man

    Homer’s in the rotation and Billy is leading off. Same old same old. Senzel, Winker, and Hunter Greene are hurt. Mr. India meet Mr Banana Peel!! I agree with Bill….not been around as long, but its as hopeless as I can ever remember?

    • WVRedlegs

      Hold on Indy, Big Bob is riding in with the cavalry coming to the rescue with a regiment led by Ohio native General George Armstrong Custer. Charge!

      • Indy Red Man

        I thought Custer had a Michigan connection? Egotistical and rash….Reds problems are more ignorance and apathy. Don’t know and don’t care.

  14. roger garrett

    Scooter is good and the Reds will give him an extension and rightfully so.I hope he wins the batting title but as mentioned it will not be anything big outside of Cincy.He is valued by the Reds more then any other team values him which is consistent with everybody else we have on this team and that’s good because he won’t break the bank unless we allow him too.No other team will get in to a bidding war for him which is also good.As far as Homer staying in the rotation its all about the money.He has over 200 starts in the big leagues and is on his way down.If we go back and look at his first year 40 or 50 starts and I will and give you the stats,he will look like Mahle,Romano,and all the rest.Again the consistent inconsistent way the Reds handle players.

    • Tom Mitsoff

      Gennett has a 4.7 WAR on FanGraphs for the current season, higher than Eugenio Suarez. I personally believe that Suarez is the best player on the team currently, even over Joey Votto. But I think Gennett is in the vicinity in terms of his contributions. He had a down period hitting after the All-Star break, but is picking it up again. I think many people minimize Gennett’s contributions because they see him as the player blocking Nick Senzel at second base.

      As far as a new contract for Gennett, his age works against him. I would say three to four years tops at or below the same $11 million annual figure that Suarez averages. If he can get better than that elsewhere, go right ahead and do it.

      • lwblogger2

        I think he’s going to do better than that on the open market, assuming a campaign similar to this season in 2019. If this was his walk year, I think he’d be well above 4yrs/$44-million.

  15. roger garrett

    In Homer’s first 5 years covering 78 starts his ERA was 5.42 with a WHIP of1.56 and he have up more hits then innings pitched.His last 37 starts to date are awful.My point has always been we throw our young starters away after just a few starts.Homer wouldn’t even be here if we had done that with him after the first 5 years.He got 5 years,5 years nation before he had an average year.He has been awful for 7 years and he still gets the ball ahead of some other guys.How foolish.

  16. Steve Mancuso

    The Reds don’t have to make a decision on Scooter Gennett now and it would be foolish for them to do that. Gennett is under Reds control (third arbitration year) next season, his age-29 season. Any extension would *begin* in 2020, his age-30 season.

    The Reds should wait and see how next year plays out, particularly with Nick Senzel and other new players.

    It would be pretty dumb, actually, to sign an extension with Gennett before seeing if either Gennett or Senzel could play another position.

    • Indy Red Man

      Good point. Riggleman will have to fully evaluate Senzel’s bunting technique before he make a decision:)

  17. Cary

    Grew up in Indy in the 70’s loved the reds.

    Been in Chicago since 1980. Bears and Cubs season ticket holder

    Why Cubs …. to watch the reds. You can’t imagine the improvement to the Cubs since ownership change. Incredible.

    Hoping Bears will be sold too.

    Reds…although I go to every game at Wrigley, just sickening.

    We need new owners.

  18. Jeff Reed

    The Reds have a principal owner who is a fan and that can stand in the way of hard-nosed business decisions about favorite players which would bring change and might move the team forward. Until there is a new principal owner who relies on the knowledge of the baseball people he or she has hired, the Reds will not move beyond 4th. or 5th. place in the NLC.

  19. Indy Red Man

    Isn’t there a trade deadline for playoff eligibility? Colorado is in 1st place with a -10 run differential. That tells me they win the close ones. Once again I’ll try to reason with them for the 200th time and tell them to make a good offer for Billy. He loves the outfield. He hits well there (or atleast better). CarGo and Blackmon aren’t racehorses. It makes perfect sense! I’m rooting for them, but I’d be peeved if I was a fan. They’ve added nothing really?

    • Bill

      I think the player must be with the organization prior to 1 September to be able to play in the playoffs.

  20. Bill j

    INDY I’m afraid if the Rockies offered the whole team BC wouldn’t trade BHam.