2018 Reds

Should the Reds call the Marlins about their outfielders?

The Winter Meetings are upon us, and the Hot Stove is beginning to heat up. Steve Mancuso, of course, had some unsolicited (but well-intentioned) advice for Reds GM Dick Williams, a playbook of sorts for how the Reds might want to approach the Winter Meetings and beyond. And when your manager says things like this, it makes the dreamers among us start to pay a little more attention:

“I think there are things on the horizon that give me optimism knowing the club we have is going to be better,” Cincinnati manager Bryan Price said. “I think there is room in the budget to make our ball club better in some of the areas we need.”

Over at his excellent site today, Doug Gray asks the question in the headline above: “Should the Reds call the Marlins about their outfielders?”

The Miami Marlins are open for business. After paying an insane $1.2B to buy the Miami Marlins, the new ownership group came in and started trying to find ways to immediately cut payroll as well as find more investors in the team. Over On Friday night and Saturday morning they made their first big move, trading Giancarlo Stanton to the New York Yankees. They reportedly still need to cut some payroll.

The Cincinnati Reds have more than a few needs. They need a shortstop, and they need a center fielder. They need pitching. The Marlins don’t exactly have much pitching. The Marlins don’t seem to have a shortstop worth looking into. What the Marlins do have is more outfielders. Both Christian Yelich and Marcell Ozuna are All-Star caliber players.

Go read the entire piece, as Doug analyzes precisely what it might take for the Reds to land a player such as Yelich or Ozuno.

But here’s my short answer:

If you haven’t read them already, check out Steve’s piece alongside Doug’s…and then return to let us know your answer to two questions:

(a) Should the Reds call the Marlins about their outfielders?
(b) What should the Reds be willing to give up in a trade for one of these?

UPDATE: As Steve notes in the comments below, one of his proposed offseason trades for the Reds was Billy Hamilton and Raisel Iglesias for Christian Yelich. That trade probably represents good value for both clubs.

18 thoughts on “Should the Reds call the Marlins about their outfielders?

  1. I wonder if Miami would be interested in a second basemen as it would free them to unload Castro and his salary. Duvall blandino and a young pitcher with us also picking up Prado s salary should put us in the ballpark

  2. One of my proposed offseason trades for the Reds was Billy Hamilton and Raisel Iglesias for Christian Yelich. https://redlegnation.com/2017/09/20/the-next-three-trades/

    Of course, I also talked about the Reds trading for Yelich before 2016: https://redlegnation.com/2015/10/30/a-turbulent-offseason/

    Before 2015: https://redlegnation.com/2014/11/25/making-sense-of-the-new-trade-rumors/

    And, in the Dare to Dream category, from October, 2014: https://redlegnation.com/2014/10/15/left-field-trade-targets-part-3/

    The Reds ended up with Marlon Byrd in 2015. Sigh.

    • My only issue with ur proposal is it does not cut payroll for the Marlins which seems to be one of their motivators.

      • You’re right about that. I wrote the post a while ago, before it was clear the Marlins were simply interested in shedding payroll. Reds would have to offer younger, cheaper players. Maybe eventually Marlins get around to building a serious team and want a closer. Iglesias fits their market and frugality.

        • Or we could pay for some salary for both Iglesias and Hamilton. I would pay a lot of it if the marlins would accept this deal.

    • The Marlins are looking to shed salary, so they will want young, cheap prospects.

      Jose Siri and Bob Steve are probably a good start, but the Marlins are not going to take players like Duvall or Hamilton.

  3. “Billy Hamilton and Raisel Iglesias for Christian Yelich. That trade probably represents good value for both clubs.”

    No, not good value for the Marlins. At all. Not when other teams’ interest are considered.

    When this original offer was published here, 80% (at least) of commenters below the line wrote that it was not enough for the Marlins to seriously consider.

    It is even moreso not good value for Miami, now that it is believed that the new owners heavily leveraged themselves to finance buying the team and shedding payroll for an extended period.

    Think the Cardinals might be able to offer more than 2 years cost control of negative WAR offense Hamilton and Iglesias? Especially now, after showing off their checkbook from being in the Stanton sweepstakes, and raising fans’ expectations?

    Derek Jeter really will have a steep learning curve if those 2 Reds are all the value he can extract for Yelich.

  4. They should have called already. The Reds have plenty of combinations of young talent they could offer for Yelich, but their wait-and-see approach will cost them. I look for the Cardinals to get him.
    The Reds need a couple of quality hitters in the outfield to go with Jesse Winker. The trio of Duvall, Hamilton and Schebler will collectively give you around a .250 average or below and an OBP below .300.
    It seems to me the Reds are always waiting for teams to come to them and see what is offered for their trade pieces, rather than going aggressively after players that would help them put a contending team on the field. This approach will usually, not always, result in getting mediocre players in return.

    • The Reds FO should be calling the 29 other front offices with discussions on deals. The rebuild has gone on long enough with some success in acquiring good prospects. But prospects are, in large measure, just prospects. 2018 should not be cast as another rebuild year. It’s time to do some wheeling and dealing to get the Reds out of second gear and aiming towards contention in the NL Central.

  5. Yes. Yelich and Ozuna should both be part of DW’s proactive discussions. Most of the Reds prospects should be on the table here, though not all. I wouldn’t listen on Winker, Senzel, Greene, Castillo or Mahle. But DW should be trying to include Duvall and/or Hamilton for multiple reasons. Those have been enumerated elsewhere so I won’t repeat. I’ll say Duvall, Romano and Peralta (or Iglesias) for Yelich. Or Hamilton and Peralta (or Iglesias) for Ozuna. Yes please.

  6. Jackie Bradley Jr. is supposedly available from the Red Sox. I am not sure what it would take to get him, but that is someone I wouldn’t mind seeing in CF

    • His name has been mentioned many times on RLN. He’s Hamilton Lite (or maybe Billy is Bradley Lite). There are so many better CF options than Bradley. I’d rather see Duvall, Schebler, Winker with Hamilton as a spot starter, defensive replacement, and pinch running specialist than install Bradley in center full time. Of course I’d also rather see Yelich or Ozuna or Inciarte in CF every day. Put me down as a no thanks on the Bradley option.

      • He is definitely not a Hamilton lite. His 2017 stats were down from the previous years, but he still has a lifetime OBP of .318 compared to Hamiltons .298, and OPS .726 vs .632. OF course there are better options, but that doesn’t mean those better options are obtainable

  7. In my opinion the reason to get Yelich is the hope of having a lineup with Yelich, Winker, Senzel, Suarez and Votto in some order 1-5. Assuming Schebler or Duvall as the other OF, Barnhardt/Mesoraco at C and Peraza at SS (or upgrade SS with a separate trade) and that is a lineup you could contend with in 2018 and beyond. With any kind of luck (health and development of young pitchers) the pitching staff can also be respectable starting in 2018.
    With that said I would make Winker, Senzel, Suarez and Castillo untouchable. Start your trade offer with Trammel and a pitcher from the Stephenson/Mahle/Garrett/Romano/Reed group. If they insist on Greene I wouldn’t say no.

  8. We must get a solid 3+war player in CF in place this winter: 1. Yelich 2. Kiermier 3. Inciarte 4. Bradley Jr. 5. ? If that’s takes a 3 team deal we need to get it done Cin-SF-Mia, for example. Who does Miami like in SF farm system and trade Hamilton and Duvall to SF and swap those guys over with another or two of ours to Miami for Yelich or TB for Kiermier or Atl for Inciarte.

    Trading for fill in’s I don’t think is going to get us to where we need to be. GM’s are buying whole heartedly into analytics and it’s going to be harder to put together a winning team in Cincinnati. So any trade needs to result in ++ value players at the positions we need to fill CF and SS.

  9. Billy, Tyler Mahle, Taylor Trammell, and one of Vlad Gutierrez or Tony Santillan for Yelich.

    Yelich
    Suarez
    Votto
    Senzel
    Winker
    Scheb/Duvall platoon in right (they both wear down in full time status)
    Tucker
    Peraza

  10. NO, NO, NO on Ozuna. While he has great talent, he is a FA after next year and a Scott Boras client on top of it!. You are going to give up young talent for a 1 year rental? No thanks. YES, YES, YES on Yelich

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