2017 Reds

What to Expect when You’re Expecting Homer Bailey

Homer Bailey

Homer Bailey got hurt a couple of years ago and had Tommy John surgery. This is not news. In the last two seasons, he has pitched a total of 34 1/3 major league innings with an additional 28 innings pitched in the minors last year. That’s not much. And while he’s now supposedly on track, the word from Charleston was that there was some soreness and well, you know, I guess we can panic and stuff.

Except I’m not really one for panic, which you all might know. I like data.

One of my other side gigs is writing and editing for The Hardball Times. Over there, I’ve had the privilege of editing some of Jon Roegele’s work. He’s looked deeply into TJ recovery rates and there’s definitely stuff to be learned. Not encouraging stuff. But stuff nonetheless.

I really suggest you go read the article linked above as there’s a lot of material, but the relevant bit for my post is this: For a pitcher of Homer’s age, he is AT BEST a 50/50 shot to pitch a full season’s worth of innings for the rest of his career. However, there is also around a 30 percent chance that he gets it together and has a productive career from here on out.

The basic reality is this: A lot of guys come back all the way, but just as many don’t really come back at all, and plenty fall in a frustrating middle ground.

And with Homer, of course, there’s more history. He’s pitched a full season in the majors twice and has had plenty of little injuries. This may make him more likely to land in the “doesn’t make it back category.”

I’ve been saying for a while that we shouldn’t count on Homer because his return is not a given. In many ways, he should be treated like a pitching prospect and maybe not quite that. It seems that, realistically, there’s about a 1-in-3 chance that Homer becomes a legit contributor again. I don’t know about you, but I’ll be pretty disappointed if only one of Amir Garrett, Cody Reed, and Robert Stephenson end up contributing.

If I know this, you can be sure the Reds know it and it may well be why they’re hedging their bets by bringing in Scott Feldman and Bronson Arroyo. Anthony DeSclafani and Brandon Finnegan may well be the only pitchers they have who are reasonable bets to make 30 starts. I have said plenty of times that I want the young guys to play, and I do, but the Reds also have to make it through the season while sorting through the young pitchers and dealing with the innings limits many of them will come with. In short, they’re probably going to need some back up.

Especially if Homer Bailey isn’t able to pitch like the Homer Bailey we grew to know and love.

85 thoughts on “What to Expect when You’re Expecting Homer Bailey

  1. On a side note, I just read that Wily Mo Pena signed a minor league contract with Cleveland. Is this real life?

  2. Bailey and Mesaraco injuries after signing extensions have really put the team at a disdvantage. When you have a limited budget and two of your three picks to rebuild around are on the DL for two years there is not much you can do. Of course the other choice was that bum Votto who can’t get 100 RBIs a year for $20 million.

      • Hey! I retyped that whole thing and took out the curse words in the process. So does someone wanna speak up and tell me why my comment was deleted….again! Come on now, don’t be afraid, I don’t bite!

        • All I’m asking is you to be a man and speak up! Let’s talk about it like two grown men!

        • Okay, I removed the curse words when I retyped it. So what was wrong with the retype?

          • Personal attack. Any time a comment starts with …

            “There’s something wrong with you if you think Votto’s a bum. I’m tired of people like you …”

            … it will be deleted.

            Keep your comments about the Reds and not each other, please.

    • Votto’s not a bum. Besides, he had like, what, 97 RBI’s last year. But according to you 3 RBI’s makes all the difference in the world between being a bum and being good. People need to quit getting caught up in arbitrary numerical thresholds. I hate to quote a movie but it seems fitting here. In a not to recent Batman movie, Batman said that he’s whatever the city needs him to be. Votto may not be putting up the monster power numbers that so many seem to want from him but he determined awhile ago that his current approach is what was best for the team. And his numbers are pretty darn fantastic. He will be missed by the haters when he’s gone (which will hopefully be when he retires a lifetime Red). Y’all can deny that to the grave if you want but you can’t tell me any different. Votto dedicates himself to being the best version of himself and I think it’s exactly what we need. So, to some Votto’s a “hero” and to others he’s a “villain”, and that blows my freakin mind. How someone cannot appreciate what Votto does is unbelievable! He’s one of the best (if not THE best) hitters in the game. But some people can’t see past his contract or what they consider to be meager power numbers. Votto’s gonna be leading the charge of our next good team or teams bcuz his skill is nearly unmatched. He’ll be the centerpiece of our lineup, the catalyst, bcuz he’s that freakin good! I only hope that the haters will wake up one day soon and see his greatness. Yeah, I’m a big fan of Votto’s, so what! I ain’t gonna apologize for that either.

  3. Very good perspective on Bailey. On a previous post, it was pointed out that the Braves used John Smoltz as a closer after Tommy John, which might be a great solution to both preserving Bailey’s health as much as possible, as well as moving Lorenzen into the rotation. 🙂

        • I like the idea of trying him as a bullpen guy/closer. Iglesias, lorenzen, bailey as starters… Wow what might have been. If they where fully healthy and able to start I think we would be ready for another 4-5 year run at the playoffs.

        • Isn’t there a history of Bailey saying that he didn’t feel comfortable working out of the bullpen? I feel like i’ve read that on this site before. Anyone remember?

        • He would be a mighty expensive closer. Bailey is owed$19MM in ’17, $21MM in ’18, and $23MM in ’19, with a $25MM team option for 2020 that has a $5MM buyout. So he is owed $68MM (63MM + 5MM) over 3 years or $88MM over 4 years. Chapman got his $88M over 5 years. Bailey would be the most expensive closer in MLB. As soon as he could show that he would be an effective closer, he would be traded, if there were any takers. That might become a big “if”.

        • He would be a mighty expensive not-pitching-at-all, too. The Smoltz comparison was made on the chance that Homer can’t start. Better to pay him to close than to pay him to go to Texas A&M football practice.

          The contract is a sunk cost. They should use him in whatever he can most contribute. If that is only as a reliever, that beats getting no production out of him.

        • Yeah, well I never cared for canned veggies either until I was home hungry and it’s all I had.

          Pitching out of the bullpen beats not pitching at all. Just sayin’

  4. All of a sudden the Reds don’t have enough top pitching prospects. AAA pitching in the major leagues equals top 5 draft choice. Just hope we get target pitchers in the next draft batch.

    • Oh, I think they have enough prospects, but there are going to be a lot of moving pieces in the rotation as they figure out which guys go into “enough.” So they need back up plans and all that.

    • I think that the Reds have plenty of options for the rotation. It’s part of why I don’t think we need a Bronson reunion. Coming out of ST the Reds have Bailey, Disco, Finnegan, Feldman, Stephenson, Garrett, Reed, and Adelman set to compete for five spots. If an injury is foreseen with enough time, Lorenzen could also (preferably?) stretched out. There are realistic expectations (all have pitched at AA by last year) that Romano, Castillo, Travieso, Davis, Mahle, and Stephens could be ready at some point in the season. That’s 14 guys plus Lorenzen to take the mound at the start of games this year. 9 of those guys are prospects.

  5. I was previously under the impression that the %’s were better than that for Tommy john recovery. I hate to find out it’s different, but stats are stats. I read a quote from him in the last few weeks were he basically was admitting he was going to have to get use to pain while pitching.

    On a different note. I’ve always thought we rushed homer bailey to the majors and didn’t give him time to develop and work in the minors more. Why does this not apply to Stephenson (walking too many) and Garrett (developing his slider and changeup)? I do know there is only one more option for Garrett, not sure on Stephenson.

    Say hello to tim adleman in the rotation I’m afraid, although he could be a decent #5.

  6. Jon Roegele – the researcher Jason cites here – should be commended for his painstaking data collection. It’s a gigantic database and everyone interested in this topic should read the article.

    However, if you like data and if you’re looking for a reason to be more optimistic about Homer Bailey’s return, consider that Roegele doesn’t compare the TJS pitchers in his data to a control group of pitchers who didn’t have TJS. That’s huge. If you take a sample of non-TJS pitchers, you’ll find that 1-2 years later many of them are no longer in the major leagues or have small subsequent IP careers.

    In his bibliography, you’ll find two studies published in peer reviewed academic journals that do use control groups and find TJS doesn’t hinder pitchers who make it back. They get back to their previous level or even better.

    It would be foolish to suggest Bailey’s return is guaranteed. And studies like these only offer probabilities, they don’t speak to individual circumstances. But if you do like data, there’s plenty of encouraging research out there.

    • That data–that a huge % of pitchers are not going to be effective in 1-2 years, TJS or no–would indicate that long-term contracts for big money for pitchers is a bad investment, if not utterly stupid.

      That would be especially true for a smaller market team. The best bet would be to plan on churning through young pitchers, and absolutely never signing them long-term.

      • Yeah, or at least factoring into a four year contract that the pitcher might miss a while. Problem is that pitchers in the free agent years are pretty good. Hard to get by on just the young guys. Bailey’s contract was for 5 years (2015-19) covering his age 29-33 seasons. He was paid $10m-$18m-$19m-$21m-$23m+$5m buyout. If 1WAR = $8m (and it will be higher than that by 2019) Bailey had to earn 12 WAR in 5 years to pay the contract off.

      • The key becomes being able to predict which pitchers are worth the 4-5 year investment. Good GMs can probably weed out the big chunk of pitchers who aren’t.

        • Eh, they don’t have much of a track record. Denny Neagle, Mike Hampton, Barry Zito, Matt Cain, Johann Santana, Matsusaka, Zach Greinke, CC Sabathia, etc. Sabathia and Cliff Lee were OK in the front years of their contract, but essentially useless at $25mm/year later. No thanks.

          I’ve never bought the WAR = $8mm (or any number), for reasons I’ve stated before. It reflects what the dumbest, large market team has paid, not what the average team like the Reds SHOULD pay. Baseball free agent auctions (which is what they are) are not like auctions of cattle at the stockyard, which work to reflect a market price for a commodity. Free agent auctions are “won” by the team that offers the most money, with the other 29 teams pretty much believing that the “winner” overvalued the asset and overpaid. There is an economic theory that the “winner” of the auction is actually the loser. The D-Backs, for example, were the losers of the auction for Zach Greinke.

          The Mets, similarly, feel like idiots for exercising their option for Jay Bruce, because Bruce in reality was a commodity this year, not unlike Chris Carter and Brandon Moss.

          My take is that these long-term pitching contracts are a bit like the extra shots of tequila–it sounds like a good idea at the time, but rarely works out that way.

          • The $8 million figure is an average of free agent signings. So it includes big contracts and small ones, big market teams and small ones. It includes the Reds signing a one-year reliever for $2.3 million.

            I’m not a big fan of long-term contracts for pitchers (or position players) that cover their 30s. Everyone thought the Greinke contract by the DBacks was dumb. That GM has been fired.

            But Greinke was sure worth the first three years of his contract with the Dodgers, age 29-31. Cliff Lee had a 7.3 WAR season at age 34 and easily worth his contract. Sabathia age 28-31 was amazing. Santana 4.6 WAR at age 31. Roy Halladay 8.9 WAR at age 34. Zito through 31-32. Most of the guys you listed didn’t make $25 million. Notice you didn’t mention Jon Lester, Cole Hamels, King Felix, Clayton Kershaw and Max Scherzer.

            And Bailey’s contract is nothing like the most of the contracts you mentioned, both in age it covers and salary.

        • I stand by my position that the track record for these contracts is poor. Zito got $119mm and chalked up 3.0 collective WAR for the Giants. who also struck out with Matt Cain.

          The jury is still out on the contract for Kershaw, who is admittedly fabulous. He missed about 10 starts last year with a back problem, and surgery if I recall correctly. He was only 26 when they extended him, so it made more sense than some of the bad contracts. But they still owe him $131 million. And don’t get me started on why teams don’t just bunt the ball back at Jon Lester every play.

          The Reds could only “afford” to extend one of their starters, and picked Bailey over Cueto. I don’t hold it against the Reds or Bailey that he got hurt, but given how injury-prone all pitchers are, I think the decision to extend any pitcher more than 3 years is probably not wise for the Reds.

      • The O’s have a pretty strict rule about not taking pitchers past 4 years. I don’t think this is necessarily a bad idea on their part and I agree with it. That said, were the O’s perhaps an ace pitcher away from winning a pennant in the last few years? Not out of the question as they had the pen and the offense but not enough at the top of to rotation. Maybe you have to put your hat in the ring (and a lot of $$) and try to sign at least one of those kinds of guys? It’s worth thinking about.

        • It is worth thinking about. Guidelines and rules are necessary, but so is flexibility.

  7. I had been expecting Homer Bailey to be good to go when spring training started. The words GM Dick Williams spoke last Friday night probably took me by surprise. So maybe that makes that a no now, that he possibly won’t be. If Bailey starts the season on the DL and Arroyo makes about 5 of his starts and then moves to the pen when Bailey returns, that is OK. If Bailey makes about 27 starts in 2017, it will be a good season for him. I’d rather have Bailey pitching in June, July, August and September, and not necessarily April. This might be best for all involved, Bailey, the Reds and Arroyo. BA also could extend his career a year or two by becoming a 1-2 inning reliever.
    Bailey has to get out there and throw some live innings, but it will be the following couple of days after he pitches that will be most important. Hopefully his arm responds well and he progresses as spring training goes on. Win/Loss records are important to starting pitchers. But for Bailey in 2017, his number of games started and innings pitched are probably his two most important numbers to follow in 2017. His spin rate numbers on his pitches will be important. His velocity and location will be important. And then his hits allowed, BB’s allowed, and runs allowed will follow.

  8. I like the idea of trying a John Smoltz with Bailey, remembering that he did return to starting. I agree that he would be an expensive closer but if we are looking toward the long haul, this might be good idea.

    • Agreed, that money is spent either way, whether he is in the bullpen or the rotation. At this point, what’s best for Homer and the Reds long-term should be all that’s considered. Whatever that may be, hopefully the Reds find it. I will say, a bullpen of Homer, Iglesias, Storen, and Lorenzen sounds exceptionally nasty, even with Cingrani thrown in there. That would be a night and day difference between 2016’s pen and 2017’s.

        • True, but for 2017 anyway, the Reds won’t have the starters to get that done whether Homer is in the rotation or not. With innings pitched limits on the young guys and running guys like Feldman and Arroyo (presumably) out there, this rotation will give flashes of hope but will overall struggle over the course of a full season.

        • The counterpoint, of course, is that a good and deep bullpen lessens the need for starters to go deeper into the game. So 5 decent innings instead of 6.

        • My thought on this issue is that in a rebuild such as the Reds are undergoing, the goal is to have both a viable rotation and viable pen at approximately the same point.

          Accordingly, they may need to slow the development of MLB rotation a bit to insure they get enough innings out of starters to allow a healthy development of the bullpen because in the long run it will do them little good if bullpen arms are burned through making up for starters that struggle to get thru 5 innings, let alone 6 or into the 7th.

          Hence the need for someone like Feldman or even a sunken cost guy like Bailey, if physically able, to just eat innings a couple of days a week.

    • You can’t worry about the cost at this point — it’s a sunk cost. The point now is to determine how best to keep him as healthy as possible while helping the team as much as possible.

  9. Bailey was passing though Cincy last week. C.Trent caught up with him and filed this article:

    http://www.cincinnati.com/story/sports/mlb/reds/2017/01/29/reds-starter-homer-bailey-says-he-should-ready-spring/97187030/

    Here is an interesting quote from Bailey about life post TJS. C.Trent prefaced it by saying that Bailey “balks” at the use of the term “normal”.


    “I don’t think there is such a thing as normal anymore, but everything is OK,” he said. “I’m getting ready to play a baseball season. I haven’t had a lot of time to think about how things have felt because I’ve been too busy just working out, throwing and getting in shape.”

  10. There are plenty of arms in the minors. I expect little out of Bailey this year. Anything he contributes could be a plus.
    Among Garrett, Stephenson and Reed, I think only one will ever become an “impact” pitcher for the Reds. Sorry to say, and I hope I am wrong, but that is not untypical for so-called High Prospects, even when they reach AAA ball. One in three. I think it will be Garrett, personally. Reed has a great arm, but has serious control issues regarding location. He throws strikes, but a lot of balls up in the zone and his slider sometimes just spins up there.

    The next cohort will also probably only deliver a couple of real impact pitchers. Consider how much we hoped for Cingrani, yet after a couple of years, he looks stalled in his development, if not actually regressing.

    • David, your estimate is probably pretty accurate. That’s why building up as much young promising talent in the farm system is key, which is what the front office has been doing. It’s my belief you can never have too much talent at any one position, because the cream that rises from a crop of 10 will probably be better than the cream that rises from two or three.

      I am very hopeful that Stephenson, Reed and Garrett all will make it, but there is absolutely no evidence yet that any of them will. I say make everyone not named DeSclafani and Iglesias (and Bailey, if healthy) fight for positions on the pitching staff. This is how you find out who is the cream of the crop, not by their slot on a depth chart or prospect ratings list.

      • If you look at the trade for Cueto with KC, we got three pitchers; Lamb, Finnegan and Reed.
        Lamb was “almost ready”, and now where is he?
        Finnegan was a tweener, in that he was an effective reliever, but wanted to start. the Reds invested a year of his career getting him groomed to be an effective starter. I think he will pan out.
        Reed has a great arm, but I have my doubts about him being an effective ML pitcher. He may surprise us all and be very good this Spring and jump into the Majors, but ….maybe.
        Stephenson. Meh.
        Again, one in three makes it.
        In the next cohort, I think this guy they just traded for, Castillo, has a great upside. And then Tyler Mahle. And that’s it. I don’t expect much out of Travieso. Sal Romano seems to have a great arm, but time will tell.
        Rookie Davis will probably end up being a reliever (and could be a good one). He’s got a big body and throws hard, but does it sell in the Majors?

  11. Two RH relievers have become available over yesterday and today that could help the Reds bullpen. The Brewers DFA’d Rob Scahill yesterday as they picked up a 2B/SS. And the Cubs DFA’d Dylan Floro today to make room for another player acquired. Scahill had a good 2015 in PIT and a good 2016 in PIT and MIL. Floro is younger and hasa good sinker. Both have good GB rates, low BB and HR rates.
    Floro is one I would certainly take a look at. With the Reds first in the NL to make a waiver wire selection, he would come from the Cubs for free.

  12. There have been questions about Homer’s durability for a long time. Nothing I have read would dispell those questions. In fact, it would seem highly improbable that he makes more than a handful of starts this year. In what world will he return from nearly two full years of inactivity to becoming a regular SP this year? The best possible scenario might be him fulfilling a role of a few starts at some point in the season after extended ST, with a bullpen role prominent during this season. MAYBE!

    This may seem pessimistic, I think perhaps it is simply being realistic, considering all the variables being discussed here. We could end up going through a whole lot of the arms that have been mentioned here. This highlights again, the unique nature of what was pulled off a few years ago with our rotation and the number of starts made by our primary 5 starters that year!

  13. Cross fingers, hope for the best. Really, it’s about all any team (and its fanbase) can do. I have friends of the impression that Homer won’t make it back because he’s made his money and isn’t trying hard enough. I doubt any of them would be brave enough to say it to his face. Surgery like that is a mental challenge just as large as a physical one. Each time that elbow barks at him he’s wondering if he’ll need to do it all over again. Each pitcher is different. Let’s hope Bailey comes back and can give them 20-25 starts this year, finishing the year healthy.

  14. Jason, a suggestion for a follow-up article:

    What to Expect When Jumbo Diaz is Expanding?

    (apologies to JD. I could’ve used a number of different Reds pitchers/prospects)

    • Newton’s universal law of gravitation would suggest a declining fastball velocity because of an increasing delta between the mass of the ball and the mass of the originator of the ball…

      Hmmmm…. sounds like a rousing article! 😉

  15. Spoken like a true optimist LW! I hope you are right. If that happens we could end up being a team that goes out there each day with a legitimate chance of winning. That wouldn’t be bad at all. After all, anybody with multiple no hitters to his credit is way ahead of the game. We need Honer to be that guy again, not the one that got paid and ‘isn’t trying hard enough’. I am sure we have all heard similar thoughts. For myself, I have never had TJ surgery, so cannot compare it to anything else. But having read experiences of other pitchers, including one example mentioned above, it’s not a walk in the park. Now I’m rambling…let’s go with your thought and ‘hope for the best’!

  16. Not a lot of optimistic speak about Bailey this spring. Replacing yet another arm would almost certainly stretch out the rebuild process.

    I would think they were aware of Bailey’s status prior to trading Desclafani. If so, then the Reds are more optimistic on the young arms that most, at least on here, are seeing.

  17. As far as I’m concerned, Homer shouldn’t be on this team. Homer didn’t deserve that contract before the injury, as far as I’m concerned. Leake deserved that contract more than Homer. Plus, in my opinion, Homer hasn’t been much of a “clubhouse guy”. I mean, for example, when the Reds traded Bruce, there was Homer talking down about the Reds trading not only Bruce away but others. Any kind of talk like that only hurts the club.

    I can’t help thinking that Walt was simply asking too much for Homer. And, now, that makes Homer’s contract simply a bad contract for us.

    • That’s a hard stance. He was on the upswing at the time, Cueto was hurt and Leake hadn’t yet shown any consistency (has he at all yet?). Homer was just off his best season and showing “Ace” stuff.

      • Right. One season. He’s been a headcase. Optioned often. Injury prone as well. Only 2 seasons of 200+ innings, no other season over 150. No season with an ERA under 3.49.

        Hey, I’ve said the stats may show he’s a #1 pitcher. And, his stuff may be #1 stuff. But, there are 30 #1 pitchers in the league. A single stat may show him in the top 10 in something. But, overall, I just can’t see him better than even half of the other #1 guys in the league.

    • Curious what your definition of “clubhouse guy” is. Usually that means someone who is liked by his teammates and good for team unity. But you criticize Bailey for talking down the Reds organization for trading Jay Bruce. Isn’t that exactly what you’d want a “clubhouse guy” to do, defend his longtime teammate. You think being a toady for every move the front office makes is what a good “clubhouse guy” should do? Seems backwards to me.

      • I think you’re right on with this Steve (M). Stepping up for a teammate and being willing to take the flak is much more of a “clubhouse” move. People are kidding themselves if they think there isn’t some inherent “us vs. them” mentality from the team to the front office.

        Not saying anything is being a good “company man,” in which he is “yes man” to the powers that be.

        • So, it’s much better to whine about something in public? Can I have a little bit of cheese with that?

          Homer’s got enough of a problem himself being one of worst #1 men in the game right now, at best since he hasn’t pitched essentially for 2 seasons, which would lend one to believe he would be starting at best as a #2 if not #3 man. Homer has no reason nor right to be complaining about anything. He needs to be concentrating on straightening out his own act. If he’s had 4 20-game win seasons and 3 CY on the shelf, then he could possibly be believed to have a say in how the team is run. But, he doesn’t. He has never been an All-Star nor seemingly never finished high enough in the CY to be listed on baseball-reference.com.

        • Steve S: I have to side with Steve M. on this one. Bailey has been injured and inconsistent and, I’m sure, disappointing to himself. But he certainly hasn’t forfeited his right to express his opinion. He wasn’t whining about his fate, after all, but supporting a long-time teammate.

  18. I am looking forward to reading the article Jason mentions in his post. I might also recommend Jeff Passan’s The Arm which is excellent and pretty much convinced me that Homer isn’t coming back. There’s a pretty big mental side to all of this along with the physical part that makes me really doubtful.

    My hope is that the Reds are bringing in Arroyo to try to get Homer back. If anyone can do it, Bronson can. If not, what a waste of $100 million. Have to wonder if it becomes obvious that he’s done if Homer will retire or stick around collect money for nothing while complaining about how the front office can’t afford his buddies.

    • So, as many of my friends seem to be, you are in the “Homer isn’t mentally tough enough.” or “Homer isn’t trying hard enough.” camp? If that’s the case, I’m not sure what Arroyo may be able to do to help the situation. What do you think?

      • I don’t believe Homer isn’t trying hard enough. Maybe not trying hard enough to keep his mouth shut while collecting millions for nothing, but that’s beside the point.

        I’ve always believed Homer to be a bit of a head case. I know that’s not a popular opinion in these parts and certainly there are no metrics to back it up, but it’s my opinion.

        I think Homer had his best years with Bronson as his mentor. I hope that happens again. But, you may be right that it might be a lost cause at this point. For the sake of the club and the fans, I hope not.

  19. Homer is a .500 pitcher at best that got lucky with two no-hitters. Trade him for a good bat boy

    • I saw those no-hitters, and they didn’t look like luck to me. They looked like a pitcher with dominant stuff. And a .500 pitcher on a sub-.500 team would seem to have something to recommend him, even allowing for the questionable importance of the win stat.

    • Very hard to move a guy who’s on the DL. Reds need to hope he can pitch and pitch effectively. Then he either helps the team win or the Reds may have at least a slight chance of trading him. The “trade him” suggestion when it comes to every struggling player is a lot easier said than done. MLB contracts are guaranteed money and nobody will want a guy making good money and who has serious injury concerns.

  20. Im optimistic that Bailey can pitch effectively.I don’t think he is a #1 stud tough.Im concerned with Bronson being given a minor league contract.This move says we are short of stable starting pitching.Its financially sound ,no risk. However,looks like a strong plan “B” statement.

  21. Steve, I understand now and will try my best in the future to watch that. But, that being said, I didn’t think my rewrite was all that bad. Not as bad as the first draft anyway. But the reason I attacked him is because he attacked my favorite plyr by calling him a bum. So I attacked back. But, it was just a culmination of ALL the freakin Votto haters that I’ve seen on social media. I really don’t understand how a person who calls themselves a Reds fan can’t understand and appreciate Votto’s greatness and just how good & valuable he is to this team. All they can see is his contract. It’s a crying shame. We’re gonna be playing winning baseball again sometime soon and then these people are gonna want Votto on the team, leading the offense. Some of them will try to deny this to the grave and it’s like, whatever dude, just leave me alone and go on with your life. I also realize that Votto don’t need me to come to his defense, but I had reached my breaking point with all the haters. I also know that some out there will say that they don’t hate Votto it’s just that his contract don’t make sense for a rebuilding club or a small market team, blah, blah, blah. Sometimes you gotta keep the great ones…no matter what. I could keep going but I’m gonna end it here.

    • Difference between attacking the Votto hate and attacking the Votto haters. We need to keep it on the Reds and not the fans/other writers.

      • Steve, I understand. Sometimes it’s difficult not to attack the source of the hate, though. But thanx for your understanding and I’ll watch that in the future.

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