2016 Reds / Titanic Struggle Recap

Titanic Struggle Recap: D’oh!-lendorf

Final R H E
Cincinnati Reds (44-64) 2 6 2
Pittsburgh Pirates (54-53) 3 6 0
W: Watson (2-3) L: Ohlendorf (5-7)
FanGraphs Win Probability | Box Score

The Good
–With the Pirates leading 2-1 in the top of the ninth, Eugenio Suarez led off with a walk. Tucker Barnhart popped up a bunt, and was barely nabbed at first on a good play by Francisco Cervelli, the Pirate catcher, but Suarez advanced to second. A couple of pitches later, Suarez stole third base, then scored — and tied the game — when Ramon Cabrera lined out to left field.

–Another solid start from Anthony DeSclafani: six innings, two runs allowed on two hits. He didn’t improve his record to 7-0, but Disco Tony continues to impress.

–Brandon Phillips was 2-3 with a walk and an RBI. Joey Votto and Billy Hamilton each had a hit and a walk (and, to be fair, Hamilton had an awful at-bat in the ninth.

–Michael Lorenzen and Blake Wood weren’t particularly sharp, but they each pitched a scoreless inning of relief.

The Bad
–With the score tied in the bottom of the ninth, manager Bryan Price chose to bring in Ross Ohlendorf to pitch. The ending was predictable: a walkoff homer to the first batter he faced, the 24th time this season that a Reds reliever surrendered a home run to the first hitter.

–Did Ohlendorf pitch because Raisel Iglesias was unavailable, thanks to pitching an unnecessary second inning in a 7-0 game last night? Inquiring minds want to know.

–With two on and two out in the eighth, and the Reds down 2-1, Scott Schebler struck out swinging. Schebler was 0-4 with three strikeouts tonight.

–Suarez and Barnhart each had errors.

Not-So-Random Thoughts
–That stinks.

–Interesting play in the fifth, when John Jaso lifted a deep fly ball to left field that Hamilton almost made a great play on. Hamilton leaped high on the wall, the ball hit his glove, then Hamilton grabbed the ball as he fell to the ground, before it hit the warning track. Unfortunately, the replay showed that the ball hit the wall before Hamilton caught it, but it was a tremendous effort.

–What are you gonna do? Reds need to win the next two to keep their streak of consecutive series’ won intact. They can do it, right?

60 thoughts on “Titanic Struggle Recap: D’oh!-lendorf

  1. If you can’t trust Ohlendorf to pitch with a 7 run lead vs the Cardinals, you certainly don’t want him in a tie game. He really was a horrible signing.

    • Instead Iglesias was used for 2 innings when the Reds had a 7 run lead against the Cardinals. Why has Iglesias over the past week been used in routs but not in close games ?

    • A former Enquirer reporter once said of Dusty Baker that you had to be careful about giving him players he could misuse (i.e. guys that he would play more than he should because for whatever reason he like them) think guys like Corey Patterson or Wili Taveres. I think Ohlendorf is that guy with Price. A guy that has a role on this team that should be as a mop up guy or someone to pitch with a mutli-run lead in the sixth inning but not a guy you put in a tie game in the eighth or ninth inning.

    • Someone in the front office must have figured Ohlendorf can’t be that bad since he’s a Princeton U. graduate.

      • It’s pretty weird that people are complying about using Iglesiusus (a possible future starter) in a limited multi inning role this year to reduce wear on his shoulder. I think this is the ONLY smart decision Price has been making. Who cares if it costs a couple games in a lost season?

        • I think people are complaining about Price using Iglesias for two innings that weren’t high leverage against the Cards and then being unavailable when the Reds could have used him tonight.

          It’s like having different drill bits for different materials. Any will go through plaster, not all with go through tile and concrete. Use them according to need and you should be good.

  2. The pitch Iglesias two innings in a 7 run game to save Ohlendorf for tonight? So it would appear. Yet some in the Cincinnati media want to give Price an extension. Firing him at this point won’t accomplish anything, but giving him an extension would be criminally stupid. Play out the string, let him go at the end of his contract and hire someone who can actually manage.

    • Do you have anyone in mind? And I ask that seriously, not sarcastically.

      • I’d love to see Dave Martinez… Doubt it will happen but that guy needs a shot to manage someone.

  3. That’s why Price is not suited to be a Manager, countless wrong bullpen decisions.

    • Bryan Price has been a well regarded pitching coach, but managing, for him, seems to be the Peter Principle in action.

  4. Rough game for Duvall and Schebler. Combined 0 for 8 with 4 strikeouts. Ouch. The future left fielder, Jesse Winker, went 4 for 5 tonight. Hope abounds!

    Nice steal by Suarez in a big spot. Too bad they couldn’t get Cozart and Votto up in the 10th to give themselves a chance.

    • I’ve been critical of Suarez for getting thrown out trying to steal 3rd 2 or 3 times. Tonight he got a great jump in a huge situation and Cabrera got him home.
      Excellent work by both, wasted immediately.

      • There was a play involving Suarez–the one where he hit a grounder up the middle and Harrison made a great play and throw while falling away from first. The thing is, the throw had no zip and it looked to me as though Suarez could have beaten it out if he had been running hard. Maybe he was dogging it because he was certain it was going through for a single? I noticed later in the game that he ran full out on a routine grounder, so I suppose he might have gotten some corrective criticism from somebody.

    • Dusty vs Price demonstrates why a paint by numbers bullpen approach is safe and usually sound. Sure you create an artificial box of roles and expectations but 4 times of 5 you’re good.

      Be fluid and unencumbered by performance or game situations and you become a good bullpen coach evolved to a poor manager.

      It kills me to think Dusty’s roles delivered a more consistent product.

      It bears mentioning that Lorenzen and Iglesias dictate the ‘roles’ approach now. Price seems to think he has a
      Mixed bag of Hoover’s left arm, an undead Stormy Weathers, Danny Graves’ fastball, and Kevin Gregg (unadulterated). Pick your poison was the first two and a half months. Now it’s time to start noticing the good, the bad, and the ugly Bryan

      • “Pick your poison was the first two and a half months. Now it’s time to start noticing the good, the bad, and the ugly Bryan.”

        Exactly the point. Price could not be blamed when the entire bullpen was horrible. Now he has Iglesias, Lorenzen, Cingrani, Wood to work with, and he’s showing what he’s got at bullpen management.
        Good, bad, and ugly sums it up well.

      • Not defending Dusty, but he did have more consistent bullpen talent, leading to more consistent results.

        But your larger point remains, Price has enough pieces to effectively navigate most late inning situations. We should be able to effectively judge is aptitude at this point.

  5. A positive is that by using Inglesias yesterday Bryan contributed to his health and development.

    • If you’re being sarcastic, OK. If not, using Iglesias today instead of against the Cardinals with a 7 run lead would also have contributed to his health and development and also perhaps a Reds win.

      • I actually agree, the stated mission is to get Iglesius multi inning appearances so he can return to starting next year.

      • Perhaps because Price can’t see the future?

        Iglesias hadn’t pitched for 4-5 days, and you don’t know if you’re going to be able to get him in a high leverage situation the next game. Plus, wasn’t Iglesias warming up when the Reds widened the lead to 7-0 on Thursday? If I’m Price, when a guy with shoulder issues is warmed up in a dead season, he’s coming into the game, regardless of the lead.

        There are lot of reasons to criticize Price, but jeez, y’all make me feel sorry the guy.

      • We are a tough crowd as Reds fans. Aroldis throws 70 innings in a season and we all scream for more innings. Had he thrown 2 innings here and there and ended up with 110, but missed a high-leverage situation – Price should be fired?

        Iglesias need work. Perhaps it should be regular work. Price doesn’t have a crystal ball. It shouldn’t have been Ohlendorf in the 9th – we all agree. But I suspect the majority of Reds fans would agree this season is more about prospects, arm rehabilitation, and talent evaluation, not who’s brought into pitch the 9th.

  6. Ok so what? We all know that this is a season to grow pitchers. Isn’t Ohlendorf on the staff? Better he is used in this type of situation this year to see if he can develop. Pitchers improve and gain experience only by being placed in those situations. I get the criticism but don’t get the double standards. We don’t know if Ohlendorf will or wont be here next year. Price doesn’t know that answer either but he works him with an assumption that he needs to develop so I give him props for that.
    The use of Iglesias for 2 innings I also don’t have a problem with. Saved the use of additional reliver and perhaps it is also part of a routine to stretch Iglesias out for a spot start. Am I the only one that notices that just about every time he pitches it is for 2 innings?

    • Ohlendorf is a 33-year-old journeyman. He is not still developing. I think people are upset because they pitched a poor reliever who isn’t part of the team’s future when better pitchers who could use the experience in a high leverage situation could have pitched (Cingrani for example).

      We all notice that Iglesias is pitching multiple innings and Lorenzen has frequently as well. I don’t mind him pitching two innings. I wasn’t crazy about him pitching at all in the final game of the Cardinals series, but I think there are plenty of other reasons they lost tonight.

      • Right. If this season is about developing pitchers, why is Ohlendorf even on the roster ?

      • This This This.

        When the bullpen was God-awful, Ohlendorf might have been one of the better of the not-goods. Now, he’s not the one you want in a high-leverage situation. Price wouldn’t play Peraza because he says he is trying to win. OK, so how is Ohlendor’s usage right now demonstrating that Price is trying to win?

      • I don’t want to be one to disagree with you Nick but the rebuild needs to have room for older players even if they will be with us for just a year or two. Ohlendorf’s uniqueness should give him another year or two with the club in my humble opinion. I’m not a GM or scout but it seems like he has a special place on this team otherwise he wouldn’t be there now. If we are going to Jettison everyone over 30 then goodbye Joey Votto. Maybe all he will ever be is just a temporary roster filler but I see potential with the guy.

        • Good thoughts, Dan. We actually don’t disagree on your point in this second comment. I never said anything about getting rid of all veteran players. My point was that Ohlendorf isn’t developing. His development period is long gone. So that can’t be a reason why Price would have him in over other pitchers who are still developing.

          Yes, the team probably does need some veteran relievers in the future. The question is whether Ohlendorf is good enough to warrant a spot.

        • I think you are being kind calling Ohlendorf a “journeyman”. I would wager that if and when the Reds dump him he is through. There is not another team going to pay him to pitch at the Major League level. The only reason he is on the Reds roster is because he was not quite as bad as half of the bullpen before pitchers started getting healthy.

        • Even if you want to entertain the notion that Ohlendorf stays on this roster next season, to stay with your original premises, he is not the one being developed for high leverage innings. He’s the mop up guy at best. At least I hope team management can eventually see that.

    • We don’t know if Ohlendorf will or wont be here next year.

      I’ll say he won’t. May not last this year either.

  7. Of course Ohlendorf was a disaster waiting to happen; but, I sat through the top of the 9th wondering if anybody in Price’s family when he was growing up was a legitimate baseball fan because I was raised with my dad and uncles from both sides reminding me that on the road you always play for the win because your next turn at bat may never come.

    • I don’t blame him for playing for the tie in that situation, with the bottom of the order coming up.

      • My dad and uncles (were they still around) would tell me to expect as much seeing as how you are from the “big city” 🙂

        • In fairness, my uncle who was the least sports inclined was a proud holder of an MA from Columbia U. Taught school in rural Ohio then at the end of each school year hopped the train to NYC for however many summers it took him to get it done.

  8. When your a relief pitcher and you pitch maybe 1 inning every other game or every 3rd game and your 5-7!! Your terrible!!!

    • Good point. 7 losses for a bullpen pitcher is awful. The meaning of the 5 wins (blown leads or good innings) would have to be looked up.

  9. I think the overall sentiment that needs to be highlighted is the fact that no one would be upset if Iglesias, Lorenzen, Cingrani, or even an over extended Descalafani gave up the game winner. The point is, that as an organization the Reds should not be “auditioning” a 30 plus year old in high leverage situations. Smart fans, which we are, since we read Redleg Nation, will understand this. Overall bad bullpen management by Price. I really think that there is a disconnect between him and the FO.

      • So, Pinson, in your opinion, is there a chance that the FO will tire of this utter incompetence by the manager, or will they decide to stay the stated course and actually try to develop a contender in the near future?

  10. Chad, I’m putting this comment here because I just read your So Long, Jay Bruce post and it seems too late to comment there. I read your full article, and as a Jay Bruce fan (and a native New Yorker who was in NY at that time as Yankee fans too were excited about this Bruce kid), I enjoyed it immensely.

    A friend of mine is a Giants fan living in SF. Yet his son’s favorite player is Jay Bruce and he had a similar experience to your son’s.

  11. I read in the comments in here on a regular basis about the manager not having an impact on the outcome of the game. The decision made last night who to pitch in a tie game late shows one of the glaring places the managers input affects wins and losses. I have no way of knowing had he made a different decision on the dregs available. The filling out a line up may not mean much in the win column but when and who to put on the mound makes the manager or in our case the lack of an important part of the equation.

    • I don’t recall anyone saying the manager has no impact on the game. The point is that the manager’s impact is often exaggerated, particularly when the commenter doesn’t like the manager. Selecting the pitcher for a crucial situation is seemingly a place where a manager has impact on the outcome, though you need to remember that any pitcher can–and does–give give up homers.

      • As one who has said more than once that the manager has minimal impact on the game between the lines, your comments are spot on for me GREENMTRED.

  12. It IS an old adage you play for the win on the road because you don’t have the last at bat. Another reason the Reds should have played for the win is we had no bullpen worth anything after Price burned Iglesias with 2 inning the night before and Cingrani (although I still would have used him last night. I prophesied this was going to happen yesterday.
    Of course it is really amuse point about Barnhart bunting, there are all kinds of possibilities where he doesn’t get a hit and doesn’t move Suarez to second and Reds lose right there. Then he could of hit a homer and we are up 3-2 and CIngrani riches the ninth. Although I don’t know id Cingrani was up in the bullpen.

  13. I know last night’s loss had a negative impact on the “Drive to 65” wins. The Brewers hold on 4th had become somewhat tenuous and I could hear the sigh of relief behind the Cheddar Curtain once the ball cleared the fence last night.

    I understand that Ohlendiaz is north of 30….and there is an extreme probability that he is at best a band aid for a re-building team. However, this “process” likely has at least another year to go before a competitive team is in place. Ohlendiaz may not be young,but he’s cheap and he’s on a 1 year deal. One more loss…in a season that will produce far more than 90 of them….in order to make sure that this relatively cheap pitcher shouldn’t be part of 2017: The Drive For 75…. is a worthwhile endeavor.

    • We might have a cheddar curtain where I live, too. I can’t be certain, but its existence would explain the lack of cell service and occasional poor tv reception.

  14. OHLY will be back next year because he couldn’t possibly be as bad as he has this year.Any major leaguer worth his salt can hit 95 right down the middle.Rodriquez was sent up to bat to do just what he did.Its comical to continue to know what is going to happen and then on the first pitch it does..In all honesty the Reds got one run off a rookie pitcher which almost always happens with us.If not for Suarez and Cabrera in the ninth we wouldn’t even be talking about it.Offense didn’t show up just like last time Disco threw against the Padres.I believe we ended up losing 2-1 on you guessed it a walk off homer served up by Diaz.

  15. Jenkins, the pitching coach, could suggest Oh….. pitch at the knees. If he can’t do that, send to Louisville. Reminds me of the Jay Bruce saga, it took Barry Larkin in spring training to correct Bruce’s bad habits. Where was the batting coach for two years?

  16. 5 of our last 6 losses have been by 1 run.
    We lead the league in 1 run losses.
    Does this not tell us,the F.O as well that our manager has not used his bullpen both when good or bad,correctly.He seems to have no clue.
    He needs to go

Comments are closed.