2008 Reds / Minors / Reds - General

More rumors

From ESPN:

7:12 p.m., from Jerry Crasnick
• The Reds need pitching, but they don’t have a lot of money left after signing closer Francisco Cordero to a five-year deal. So Cincinnati is talking trade with a bunch of teams here in Nashville and using some of its young position players as bait for a starter. Jay Bruce is out of the question, and Joey Votto would be tough to get, but the Reds are listening on third baseman Edwin Encarnacion and center fielder Josh Hamilton. The Cubs are a natural fit for Hamilton, but Sean Marshall isn’t likely to get it done. One possible fit for Encarnacion: the Giants, who may need a third baseman if incumbent Pedro Feliz declines the team’s salary arbitration offer.

Maybe I’m missing something, but I like Marshall. And you’re going to have to give up something to get something.

6:16 p.m., Jayson Stark
• The Reds have asked the Marlins about Dontrelle Willis. But a deal between those two teams is unlikely. The Marlins are still placing a high price tag on Willis, so they no doubt would ask the Reds for their best young pitcher, Homer Bailey, plus one more player. And the Reds have little interest in moving Bailey. One baseball man who spoke to the Reds described their interest as “tire kicking.”

Bailey AND another player…they must be smokin’ crack.

More on a possible Hamilton/Marshall deal:

But the Cubs have talked to Cincinnati, sources said, about 26-year-old outfielder Josh Hamilton, the reformed drug addict who hit .292 in 90 games with 19 home runs and 47 RBIs in his first major-league season. Hamilton, a left-handed hitter who can play center or right, is expendable because of the glut of outfielders and the Reds’ dire need for starting pitching. The Reds reportedly are asking for left-hander Sean Marshall.

You have to ask yourself a number of questions…Was last year the start of a bright future for Hamilton or was that what you can expect from him, good numbers when he’s able to play, or was it just a lucky season? Who plays LF & RF for the Reds after this season? Bruce will be one, but who is the other (assuming they don’t re-sign Adam Dunn)? How would a trade of Hamilton effect that? Do you really want to fill 3 outfield spots in 2 years? How good will Sean Marshall be?

Hal McCoy’s take on the meetings thus far:

Both the San Francisco Giants and Chicago Cubs are looking for an outfielder with pop in his bat and that leads them to ask about Josh Hamilton.

With Adam Dunn and Ken Griffey Jr. at the corner outfield spots, the Reds have at least four center field candidates — Hamilton, rookie Jay Bruce, Ryan Freel and Norris Hopper, plus Chris Dickerson in the minors.

Hamilton is the most attractive to other teams.

“We have to make decisions on younger players (as to) whether we’d include them in a trade,” General Manager Wane Krivsky said.

The Giants could be talked out of right-hander Tim Lincecum (7-5, 4.00 earned-run average in 24 starts last season) or left-hander Noah Lowry (14-8, 3.92 in 26 starts last season).

The Cubs might be willing to part with left-hander Sean Marshall (7-8, 3.92 in 19 starts) or right-hander Sean Gallagher, although he worked out of the bullpen last year (0-0, 8.59 ERA in eight appearances).


Krivsky would not comment on reports the Reds have contacted free-agent right-hander Brett Tomko, originally the Reds’ first draft pick in 1995. Tomko was 4-12 with a 5.55 ERA with the Dodgers and Padres last season. If Tomko isn’t signed by any team, he could be offered a minor-league contract with an invitation to major-league camp.

Boston pitcher Matt Clement, coming off an injury-filled season, is an available free agent who played for the Cubs under new Reds manager Dusty Baker.

26 thoughts on “More rumors

  1. Marshall isn’t worth Hamilton, who is still a special talent…with questions.

    I’m a BIG fan of EE, but could part with him if Lincecum was in play.

    I find it very odd that EE is on the table, but Votto (who’s the same age (IIRC), but w/o the experience or defensive value) is unavailable.

    I wish Freel had some value.

  2. Marshall looks like a pretty good pitcher to me, I guess it depends on which way you believe Hamilton’s value will go.

    The article I read today said the Giants want Bruce in the deal for Lincecum.

  3. I’m with Chris on this issue. Hamilton is special (though risky). Marshall is OK but nothing great.

    Lincecum is special… I’d give up a lot for him.

  4. Jay Bruce needs to be untouchable. I’ve not seen that they were demanding him besides that one website, though. And a lot of places have said that the Giants were mostly interested in EE. I remember seeing their GM saying he wanted EE in October.

    I’d much rather see Hamilton go than EE, but I think I’d honestly give up either for Lincecum or Lowry. I think this is a better place for us to be looking than Willis or Marshall. Can Votto play third base? Or does that mean Keppinger starts?

  5. Hang on Kevin — don’t say “Lincecum” and “Lowry” in the same breath.

    Lincecum can dominate and it is no stretch to say he has ace potential.

    Lowry is a soft-tosser and if you ask me he’s already on the downside of his career.

    Lincecum – .226 OAV, 9.23 K per 9 innings last year

    Lowry – .265 OAV, 5.02 K per 9 innings last year

    I don’t want Lowry. I think he’s tending the wrong direction, badly.

    I’d MUCH rather get Jonathan Sanchez than Lowry.

    Lincecum, though… he’s amazing.

  6. Just say no to Noah.

    And they’ll never get value for Bruce. Bruce is the top prospect in baseball and should be untouchable. He’s amazing in person.

  7. none of those guys are worth hamilton
    you guys know hamilton can throw 96 right?
    put him at pitcher!
    he played pitcher in highschool.
    when he was drafted originally the rays told him to choose what postion he wanted.

  8. So Bruce for Lincecum would be bad for us? Clearly?

    What’s Dunn’s status now, by the way? Limited no-trade? Does he have a list of 10 teams or something, or am I thinking of Griffey now?

  9. By the way… let’s get Murton cheap and then we can shop outfielders w/ impunity (sp?).

    I’d be thrilled w/ an OF of:

    LF Murton
    CF Hamilton
    RF Bruce

    How much trade value do you think Dunn and/or Griffey have right now?

  10. I wouldn’t trade Bruce or Bailey, after that, trade away.

    I may be the biggest EE supporter around here, but I wouldn’t argue with trading him if the deal were right. A deal for Lincecum would be on the right track.

    I wouldn’t really have a problem with dealing Votto, either.

    Interesting to see the Reds really pursuing some pitching, though. One more good starter and this team would be very good.

  11. BP is reporting the Reds as very aggressive, and in the mix on both Bedard and Haren. Bailey could be had, but Bruce is more or less off the table.

  12. If they move Bailey, we’re still short a fifth SP (assuming Belisle is 4th in the rotation). Who takes that spot?

    Still, I think its worth it to make a run. I’d rather give up Cueto since Bailey is pretty “ready” by comparison, but what the heck…lets make a run to competitiveness right now.

  13. I like Haren, but I am worried about injuries. I also would be pained to see Homer go elsewhere after we have been so excited about him the past couple of years. It is the old saying though you have to give up something to get something.

    As far as Hal McCoy’s 2 cents, I don’t think that Tomko is the answer, but maybe Clement would be one of those guys to sign to an incentive laden deal.

  14. So far I’m not impressed with anything the Reds would get in return for Hamilton or EE.

  15. I initially thought Haren. His BAA with RISP is sick. .111 with bases loaded! However, Beane is asking for 3 blue chips in return. The Reds would be giving up Votto, EE and Cueto. No! Even if Haren has three years before FA, it is still a no.

    Bedard is a solid choice. He brings a lot of the same things to the table as Harang does. He is an innings eater and he has a good K rate. More importantly, his ERA has improved every year in the bigs.

    My problem with Lincecum is that we could have had him instead of Stubbs. If we trade say EE and someone else for Lincecum then we are essentially trading those players for Stubbs which makes my stomach churn.

  16. Tigers just pulled of an 8 player deal with the Marlins to get Willis AND Cabrera for A. Miller, Maybin and others.

  17. Drafting Stubbs over Lincecum was a mistake but it’s over. That can’t be part of the decision now. He’s a STUD and he’s young and cheap, and if we can send the Giants some hitters they need, I’d LOVE to get Lincecum.

    Haren’s great but it’s not b/c batters went 1 for 9 with the bases loaded against him this year. That’s, um, kind of a small sample.

  18. I would prefer dealing for Bedard without having to give up the ranch. A rotation of Harang, Arroyo, Bedard, Baily and Belise would be solid, especially considering the offense our current lineup is capable of. I love Jr, but if the M’s would take him for Johjima, I say go for it. Add Bedard, a catcher, and one more middle reliever (or a long guy who could be a spot starter) and I would be a happy fan. At this point, I’m not interested in a blockbuster deal. We don’t need one to get into the post season, and then it is a matter of winning a few short series to get a ring.

  19. With Griffey most likely gone after this season and the uncertainty surrounding Dunn I think it would be a mistake to get rid of Hamilton. Bruce is on his way but after that who plays the outfield? I still long for a Dunn, Hamilton, Bruce, outfield. I think EE, Votto, freel or hopper, and a lower level prospect or two could get Lincecum to Cincinnati. Cantu can play first and 3rd along with Kepp. and we still have Hatteberg. The offense is there we just need to get that one pitcher in here to put us over the edge. If we do get rid of Hamilton maybe we could get a package together to get murton and prior from the cubs.

  20. Man, these stats are mind-blowing. Look at what Lincecum did in the minors:

    Tim Lincecum

    Also, to explore a cheaper option, check out Jonathan Sanchez’s sick K numbers, at both the minor and major league level. I think he’s going to be really good.

    Jonathan Sanchez

    I’d MUCH rather have Sanchez than…

    Noah Lowry

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