Price is Right / Reds - General

The money quote

Question: Paul Daugherty, Enquirer: Aside from the obvious day to day things that a manager does, filing out a line-up card, setting a starting rotation, where do you think a manager these days has the biggest impact and where do you see yourself beyond the obvious as having the biggest impact on this team?

Answer: Bryan Price: I mentioned unity before and it’s cultivation of relationships and cultivation of an organizational or team understanding of how we play. Style of play. What are we known for as an organization? Are we relentless? Are we the team that is down by three late in the game that consistently finds a way to rally? Are we a team that consistently knocks out the starting pitcher before he can complete five innings? Are we the type of team that puts pressure on the opponent the way we run the bases? Our defensive play. Do we attack the strike zone with our pitching? We’ve been pretty good at getting the lion’s share of our innings from our starting pitchers. Can we maintain that? I’m so happy Sam LeCure is here. He’s one of those selfless relief pitchers that we’ve had here for the last several years that take the ball whenever we give it to them and pitch their hearts out.

That’s what would make me happy and proud, is if we could cultivate a relationship and create an identity as a team that nobody wants to play us. That nobody wants to play us, for those reasons. If I could have some impact on that I couldn’t be happier. That would be my goal.

Response: Redleg Nation: Amen

156 thoughts on “The money quote

  1. It’s a great quote and all touchy-feely, but it’s essentially useless 5 months before they take the field again.

    The difference between a dream and a goal is a plan. Price’s skill set is planning and execution. To that end, he can’t do it by himself. I would’ve much rather heard something, ANYTHING on the makeup of the coaching staff who will be charged with fulfilling his plan. And yet, nothing.

    Thanks reporters!!!

    • @Sultan of Swaff: Not sure what you were expecting in finding out about the coaches. They asked about it. Jocketty said clearly that they would sit down the next few days and talk about the coaches. They had to hire Price first, then move on to the coaches.

      • @Steve Mancuso: Right, a reporter asked about who the new pitching coach would be. Price answered that he’d been manager for about 2 days now and Jocketty said the above from there.

    • @Sultan of Swaff: Dude, the guy’s just been hired. Let them work on things. Do you really think it’s going to be a 5 month wait? Until we see the Reds again, yes. But, they are going to do anything but sit and wait. The three things right now are:

      – meet with the players individually and a group, to do whatever, i.e. laying down the law or whatever
      – meet with Walt about coaches; I hope Price has his list of coaches he would like to have. The thing is, those coaches need to be available and want to come. If they aren’t available or don’t want to come, Price would have to rethink things.
      – in those individual meetings with the players, setting off season goals for them to work on, expectations for them to be able to do coming in, i.e., “You need to work on your bunting”, again, or whatever, if not working them out on these aspects themselves.

      You really think they are going to sit around for 5 months?

      • @steveschoen: I guess what I was looking for was a question about whether Price would get his choice of coaches or whether that would be decided by Jocketty. It goes without saying that a new manager will want his guys, but I wonder if he’ll be given the latitude to make the hires he feels gives the team the best chance to succeed.

  2. I really like this hire, I really liked this quote as well. Sounds like Jocketty is going to be working with Price a lot more closely than he worked with Baker. Unity from the GM to the Manager to the Players could go a long way. Go Reds!

  3. I was surprised at how many times Price mentioned unity among the players. He led with that on the Daugherty question. It leads me to believe there were some divisions in the clubhouse that aren’t fully known about publicly, which isn’t surprising.

      • @Jason Linden: BP seems to have liked the selection. At least he tweeted #thepriceisright with a thumbs up. I guess that doesn’t mean BP manager likes BP player, though.

    • @Steve Mancuso: He did mention “unity” several times. When Price was asked whether the players would be more “accountable” with him than Dusty, naturally he didn’t answer that directly, but emphasized unity and preparation. In that context he even talked about giving the fans their money’s worth, win or lose.

  4. In other words, “We want to be known as the team that comes into YOUR house and kicks butt and takes names.”
    A little bit of Attitude!!!

  5. I wanted to hear any plans he had about the team and he gave none. I also wanted to hear an energetic person, but he was rather dull. I sensed no attitude from him. He also was panderign to the Advanced Metrics people out there at the end. I dont understand why so many people want someone to embrace advanced metrics, I think its overrated.

    • @gschiller13: Most of the successful teams in MLB have incorporated advanced metrics. If that’s not enough to convince you, I doubt you can be convinced. Also, if he actually believes it, it isn’t pandering. Everything I’ve seen indicates he believes it. Given how good the pitching has been, perhaps we can give him a bit of credit there?

      • @Jason Linden: Jason: I’m not anti-advanced metrics, since it seems clear that more information, if correctly interpreted, could be helpful. But: do you know for a fact that most successful MLB teams have incorporated them? And how–strategically, for player selection or both? I’m happy with the selection of Price, and firmly believe that the players on the roster will be the biggest factor in determining how good the Reds are.

        • @greenmtred: Well, we know Billy Bean uses them. A’s were in the playoffs. We know the BoSox use them. They are in the world series. We know the Rays use them and they are competitive in a division where they are competitively disadvantaged. We know the Cubbies use them. Theo Epstein is in the process of fixing the worst run organization in the majors and is only a few pieces away. I’m sure there are others. But those are the ones I know of.

    • @gschiller13: You are of course, welcome your opinion; but here’s my rebuttal in form of analogy.

      Not using advanced metrics is the same as a farmer who doesn’t use the planting cycles that have been studied for centuries. He walks out in May and says, “this feels like the right day to plant corn” and goes about his business. Will he get corn? Yes. Will he occasionally get a perfect year where he harvests so much corn that he is able to send his daughter to college on the sales? Yes. However, are there going to be times he is wrong about whether it “seems right” and thus misses? Yes Is there talent in being able to eyeball test it? Yes. BUT…

      The farmer down the street walks out on that same day and notes that the temperature is still averaging below 57 deg and the average humidity is still lower than is required for an optimal planting time. He waits a week until the numbers match up to the optimal time to plant. Since the subject is so well-studied, he is always getting the best out of his field by knowing when is the best time to put it to work. Of course there will still be down years because well-studied doesn’t mean perfect; but he will average a higher success rate simply because he’s starting out with information that puts him ahead of the game.

      • @Zach: It has only taken me a couple of comments to get that gschiller13 is simply trolling people. Why do you guys keep taking his bait? The abruptness of his contrarian comments makes it so obvious and yet he always ends up with several “rebuttals”–there is no rebuttal to trolling comments! You only inspire more of these types of comments by dignifying them with responses.

        • @EmoMorales: I guess I’ll have to pay more attention; I hadn’t seen any of his posts before (I don’t read through comments too religiously once the season is over) so I just assumed he was like my Dad who thinks that “math doesn’t really have a place in sports, save for announcers making absurd comments about absurd stats.”

        • @EmoMorales: Yeah I tried engaging them but have realized they are just trolling and not really interested in actual discourse.

        • @EmoMorales: I am not trolling. I just do not like the hire and am disappointed in the Reds. Also, i do not like advanced metrics, just my stating my opinion and I know Im in the minority.

        • @gschiller13: If you make a statement, come prepared to defend it. I’m not sure but you either aren’t willing or aren’t able to do so. (Other than to reply you aren’t a troll.)

          I’m all about having a good discussion, and I don’t thing we have to agree. But your comments sound like you are either a very new or a very casual fan. Commenting for new or casual fans at THIS site is not recommended. This is just a suggestion, but it might help to lurk a while long before posting a comment. That’s what all of us did at one time or another.

      • @Zach: One of the funnier things to me about people who scoff at “advanced” metrics is that there was a point in the evolution of the game when tracking someone’s batting average would be considered “advanced.” You mean we’re going to take the number of hits, divide it by the number of at bats, discount any walks or sacrifice plays, errors, or force outs and then get a 3 digit number less than 1 and that number is going to tell us something about how well a guy can hit? Malarky.

        Just because RBI’s are easy to count and most people can understand the idea of dividing one number by another number doesn’t mean a stat that takes a couple more calculations is somehow less telling. It’s a weird mentality. Now that’s not to say that I don’t agree that some metrics are more telling than others. I think there is room for disagreement on that. But to just say “advanced metrics are overrated” is such a silly statement.

        • @eric nyc: Good point. And actually RBIs was also an advanced metric at one time. They weren’t even kept track of until the early 20th century, long after batting average was.

      • @Zach: Seems like a solid analogy. I will point out, and not necessarily in reference to advanced metrics, that adhering unwaveringly to any theory based on new information only works if that information is accurate and relevant. And, again, talented players produce the highest yield, regardless of any theory.

    • @gschiller13: “Advanced metrics are overrated.” Care to elaborate a bit? Which metrics specifically? By your statement, I’m assuming you approved of Dusty’s old school approach to lineup construction and pitcher management. There’s a reason the old school is getting pushed out. I’m not the BIGGEST metric freak you’ll find on this board – I don’t universally abhor a well timed sacrifice bunt and I can understand the role of a particularly effective LOOGY in teh bullpen – but it’s clear that advanced metrics as a whole are important. It’s a numbers game. Just because 50 years ago the guys making the baseball cards chose to hang their hats on BA and RBI’s doesn’t mean those are more important than OBP or wRC+ or FIP.

      • @eric nyc: Eric. Any study or use of metrics that tries to say that Big Papi isnt a cluth player, is somethign Im not a believer in. That man gets big hits and is as clutch as they come. Also, I do not agree that a walk is as good as a hit. i would rather a player get a hit.

        • @gschiller13: Well we’d ALL rather someone get a hit than a walk if those are the only two options available. Unfortunately there’s usually a pesky third option called “an out.” That’s, generally, the worst of the three. Would you rather a guy get a walk than an out? You can’ thonestly think the game is THAT simple can you?

        • @gschiller13: I don’t believe you’re a troll.

          I’ve seen metrics that say Big Papi is a clutch player. And obviously a walk is not always as good as a hit, that depends on the situation. That’s why there are intentional walks. I’ve never heard anyone question that at times an intentional walk is the way to go.

    • energetic person, but he was rather dull. I sensed no attitude from him.

      Because energetic translates into what, exactly? Why is it necessarily better than calm but competent? Dad doesn’t have to yell to get the kids to listen. Sometimes, he’s just got to give the look.

      It’s an overblown narrative that yelling means someone is better or cares more. And if boring produces one of the top end rotations and marks along with it the growth of important young pitchers, sign me up twice.

      • @Matt WI: I fully agree. Yelling at MLB ballplayers and getting in their faces is a great way to have them resent you. It may have worked back in the day when guys were afraid of being released, but it isn’t the way to get things done now. Even Buck Showalter, an in your face kinda guy, has softened quite a lot in recent years. Players shouldn’t be coddled and should be held accountable getting in their faces isn’t going to be particularly effective. I never performed as well for managers that were more “stick” than “carrot” and in fact many of those I played with were the same way.

    • @gschiller13: Dude, with the guy just being hired, you aren’t going to get a bucket list. Geez, there are a lot of factors to go into everything, anyhow. What, you want “We are going to lead the league in BA” and the plan how to do it? Geez, if it was that easy, everyone would be announcing that. But, guess what, no one is announcing that.

      He was still probably all taken away by the situation. He just got hired. Let him get to work before you judge the guy. Geez. Statistics are real, they are there. They don’t ever explain why something ever happens. But, bottom line, they show things are happening. I just don’t see the need when they get so detailed as in “The OPS of our 2nd SS with the count 2-1 with one out in the 6th inning is the highest in the league. This is the time where he can finally do something.” Please. I mean, when I was growing up, the best batter in the league had the highest BA. Then, a bit latter, it was who had the highest OBP. Then, the highest SLG. Now, the OPS and OPS+ (or whatever) are popular. I will agree, at times, you have to stop and breathe for a second, get your head out of the computer. But, that won’t ever mean to ignore them. After all, it would have been stupid to bat Rose in the 6-9 holes.

  6. Are there any recordings of the PC? I’d like to see it, but was stuck in the lab running machinery this afternoon.

  7. The only thing that would have made this unity quote better is ummm…what’s the word I’m looking for?? Oh, yeah, UNITY. Lecure is probably the only Red who could afford the trip with that fat 510K paycheck. I suggest purple for the next kool-aid flavor Mr. Price!

  8. Jason and Zach you make good points. I just am underwhelmed by the hire. It just seems like a hire the Reds would make. i wanted O’Neill, i would have loved the attitude and buzz he brought to the team. I just thought Price sounded inexperienced and boring at the press conference. Reds should ahev at least waited for Mattingly to leave the Dodgers.
    In term of Advanced Metrics, I am just a non-believer. Those who beleive in it can do so, but its not for me.

    • @gschiller13: Again, which “advanced” metrics don’t you believe in? And what about them don’t you trust? Do you not believe they’re accurate? Do you not believe they can be used to help predict future performance? What stats DO you believe in? THere have to be SOME?

        • @gschiller13: Baffled? Really? RBI’s are great. They mean your team is scoring runs. But how hard is it to understand that so much of what goes into a player’s RBI count has absolutely nothing to do with that player? A player has no control on how many guys are on base when he comes to the plate…ever. So RBI’s are fine, but they don’t tell you much about a player. Any stat is only as good as it helps you predict what a guy is going to do. RBI’s are good for telling you what a guy has done situationally, but tell you nothing about what to expect in the future.

        • @gschiller13: Not everyone who thinks advanced metrics are important for player evaluation has the exact same viewpoint.
          I do not discount RBIs. There are players who do a better job than others for example at driving in a runner from 3rd with less than 2 out.

          RBIs of course are about advancing runners home – the most sophisticated metrics I’ve seen for batting look at how successful a batter is at advancing runners – including himself – vs. the outs he makes.

          RBIs are an indicator that should be taken into account along with other measures.

        • @pinson343: That’s about where I stand as well. There are times and situations where that RBI is huge, even at the expense of one of your team’s valuable 27 outs. Late in a close game is a prime example. It is this reasoning that makes me understand why people get so upset about Votto’s approach sometimes. I can see it being an issue among other players even who would wonder why look at close pitches or even strikes with that guy out on 3B, less than two outs, when putting the ball in play would likely mean a run. The way Votto explains it makes it sound as if his quality AB is more important to him than that team run. I doubt that is the case as I have seen Votto expand his zone in certain situations but he seems to have little success when he does so, or at least that was the case this year.

          So what we don’t know is does Votto think he could put a particular pitch in play for a deep fly-ball or a hard enough grounder to escape a drawn-in infield? Until you are sitting with a 2-strike count, you have to get a pitch that you’re looking for and that you know you can do something with.

        • @LWBlogger: The difference I saw (eye test?) in Votto’s AB this season compared to previous seasons was his prior propensity to repeatedly foul off those borderline pitches with deliberate ease while waiting for the pitch he could drive or the pitch well beyond the strike zone.

        • @Shchi Cossack: I saw some of that too. From a scouting perspective, he also seemed to have more ugly swings than I recall in the past and more ABs where he just didn’t look comfortable in the box. Again, eyeballing this stuff. I love Votto as a hitter and expect him to have a very good season next year.

    • @gschiller13: I would like to see some evidence of attitude and buzz from a guy who sits in the radio booth and only decides he wants to be the manager after the job is open.

    • @gschiller13: Very understandable. But, then, also remember, O’Neill has no experience coaching nor managing anywhere. And, Price does have over 10 years coaching experience. So, as for experience, Price has O’Neill beat.

    • @gschiller13: To be fair to you, I think you are using the phrase “advanced metrics” incorrectly which is causing your problem. Statistics are facts. They can’t be argued, they simply are. An RBI is an RBI, a R is a R, a SB is a SB, etc. These are basic counting statistics measured by 1, 2, 3, 4, etc. Easy to see, easy to compute. Weighted statistics are no different though. The mathematics is more sophisticated than simply county, but these too are facts which cannot be challenged.

      Using the statistics is where the real challenge comes in to play. There are linear and nonlinear regression models to say x, y, z, statistics create more runs (think money ball), and THOSE can always be argued. The statistics underlying the models cannot.

      There is one caveat – some statistics are based on trained observers, viewing each play, and assigning a value. These are highly discretionary and subjective e.g., LD% v. FB% – someone has to attribute a hit as a line drive or fly ball. These are not statistics in the traditional sense, and the observation can be challenged.

      • @David: While osme of what you say is true, I believe they are starting to measure angle of inclination on batted balls. I don’t know where the data is, but I remember reading an article about a Miguel Cabrera homer that was hit so low and hit so hard the pitcher ducked. And it went out of hte field to dead center. They stated it had the lowest angle of inclination of any homer they could find.

        So, with that said, the difference between a line drive and a fly ball is likely a particular value. It’s not subjective. It’s objective.

        The other things you alude to (liek DRS, for example) are absoultey subjective. However, each person is trained the same way and uses the same methodology when watching plays. It’s not fool proof, but sticking to “errors” as a measure of how good a fielder is is even worse than trusting a trained professional’s opinion of a play.

  9. While this is a great hire, we still need Uncle Walt to step up and make some sort of intelligent trade or move this off season to give Price and the big left handed bats in this lineup something to balance it out.

    If the Reds called Detroit and offered Phillips for Castellanos, they would listen and most likely ask for more, but that’s where most deals start. What more would they want? Could we extend it to getting Scherzer and Castellanos since it’s obvious they can’t afford him when he hits FA. What more would the Reds need to add? Chapman and Stephenson?

    Good day to be a Reds fan, no matter what the minority say.

    • @rfay00: The first thing I’d say if I was Detroit’s GM is “Why shouldn’t I just resign Infante if I am taking on all BP’s contract in this alleged deal?”

  10. What makes you think that Paul O’Neill would be a great manager? Great players often aren’t great coaches. Coaching is about getting the most out of a person and communication.

    Price, according to half the existing Reds team, the GM, the owner and 97% of Redsland feel that they have a coach who can communicate and get the best out of the talent.

    The talent is responding positively from Bronson, to Latos to Sam (who was there in support today) to Homer Bailey. Jay Bruce chimed in though he is not one of his staff.

    but do not let facts get in the way of how you feel….

    your comments on the Reds managerial situation go on ignore go forward

    • @reaganspad: Reagan, I dont know if O’Neill would be a great manager, just like you have no idea if Price will. I am a huge O’Neill fan and I would have given him a chance.I am sorry, I just dont like Price. You like him and thats fine, I respect your opinion.

  11. I got to thinking … what ARE the Reds known for?

    Hacking at the first pitch
    Knockdown pitches with the Pirates
    Not winning the big game.

    Seems like all that is pretty easy to fix.

  12. Bob C.: “There was no thought about a new manager until we had our meeting with Dusty and then we started to think about it and we didn’t have to think very long or very far.”

    I thought that was a telling statement. Bob C. was a big supporter of Dusty’s. Something dramatic happened at that meeting. And it had something to do with Dusty and WJ having serious differences on how “to go forward”.

    • @pinson343: Though I have no way of knowing, we can surmise what Dusty would have said based on how Dusty has dealt with adversity before. I bet Walt and Bob sat him down and asked the simple questions, like “what do you think went wrong this year?”, “what are you planning on changing next year?”, and “who do you think should be at fault for the collapse at the end of the year?”.

      Knowing Dusty from his interviews, I bet he said something like, “we just didn’t get hot at the right times”, or “we just need to stick the course and players need to step up and we’ll win one eventually”

      Turning blame away from himself and onto the players, as well as providing no indication of changing philosophies and personnel is ultimately what I believe made Walt and Bob jump out of their shoes and fire him immediately. However, like I said, we will never know.

    • @pinson343: Bob C.: “There was no thought about a new manager until we had our meeting with Dusty and then we started to think about it and we didn’t have to think very long or very far.”

      Interesting how folks can “take” statements in different ways. I saw and heard this statement on the replay of the presser. In the total context, my take was that Castellini was simply saying that they had not thought about who would replace Dusty prior to the time they told Dusty of their already determined decision that Dusty would be canned.

      In other words, they knew going into the meeting with Dusty that they were going to can him, not that his departure was decided upon because of the course of the meeting.

      I thought the statement was made to put aside some of the buzz that this was essentially a palace coup to replace Baker with Price in order to keep Price from leaving the org.

      • @OhioJim: I took it to mean “We have enough respect for Dusty to say that we sat down and talked to him before deciding to fire him.” I think Bob made up his mind by the third inning of the WC game, but he’s classy enough to let Dusty save some face by saying they at least met with him before making up their mind.

  13. more on why the Reds moved quickly. Not only did we realize that we had the right guy, but others thought he was the right guy also:

    On Tuesday, the Cincinnati Reds announced that they have selected pitching coach Bryan Price to replace Dusty Baker, naming him to take over the reins of the team for the next three seasons. That news likely comes as a disappointment to Ruben Amaro Jr. and the Philadelphia Phillies, who were hoping to hire Price themselves.

  14. Price: “Of all the things I didn’t like doing a great deal was when we had a lot of situational pitchers and matchup guys … I never really enjoyed the matchup game so much … Also you have to show confidence in your guys.”

    I loved to hear that. When talking about Price, Bronson talked about some traditional ways of thinking in baseball that didn’t make sense to him, and that Price would do his own thinking based on evidence.

    And Sam LeCure expressed differences of opinion with Dusty’s in-game strategies.

    My guess is that they’re both with Price on this one.

    • @pinson343: I can understand “situational strategies”. But, I think Baker took them to such an extreme that he pigeon-holed himself many times. Like Price said, “You have to show confidence in your players”, supposedly a trademark of a players manager. And, I think it would be assuming easily enough that Price was referring to Baker not showing confidence in his players during many of these times, aka not being a players manager during these times.

      Baker may have been a players manager, aka showing confidence in his players, but he was only that to those players, “his players”, “his boys”, Stubbs, Gomes, Harris, Patterson, Tavaras, among many others. But, Frazier goes 4 for 4, then he sits, “Have to get Harris going”. Ludwick goes 4 for 4, then sits, “Have to get Heisey going.” But, Stubbs goes 0 for 40 and still plays, “Have to get Stubbs going”.

      • @steveschoen: Agreed. And of course Price understands situational strategies, he mentioned their importance.

        I think one thing Price may have been bothered by was Dusty’s lefty vs. lefty and right vs. right obsession with pitching match ups, often not considering who the best pitcher was, or that some righties (like Sam LeCure) are tough on lefties, etc.

      • @steveschoen: Like, Baker with his lefty-righty-lefty stuff, he handcuffed himself in never using Bruce in the 4 hole, then, for a situation that may happen, what, twice a week at most, and actually end up work against us twice a month at most? Not saying I would definitely put Bruce in the 4 hole; I would like to have a righty in there to break up Votto and Bruce. But, without one, or with righty starters, I wouldn’t have a problem putting them back to back. He probably could have gotten so much more out of that than he did, if he put Votto and Bruce back to back more than he did. But, he was afraid of the Loogy situation late in games, thus, he never did it. It was like, “I’m not going to do that, so I save 50 cents there.” But, then, if he had done it, “Darn, I lost 50 cents in those games, but then, I made a buck 50 in these other games. Boy, I should have done it a bit more often.”

        • @steveschoen: I’d disagree in that in fact Bruce did hit in the 4-hole in 25 games this season. Where I do agree is in why not do it more often and not be afraid of that late game situation you mention? I mean in those 25 games, accounting for 114 PA, Bruce slashed .280.407.505 and walked 20 times while striking out 22 times. 114 PA is a small sample size but he was clearly effective in that 4-hole when he was allowed to hit there.

        • @LWBlogger: But, before this past season, how often did he do it? Shoot, it took Baker losing Ludwick and BP to injury for him to do it. If you noticed, as soon as either of them got better, Bruce was back to #5.

        • @steveschoen: Pretty much never. That whole dreaded lefty/lefty matchup for two straight batters late in the game scared him. Drove me crazy. I’d love to see Bruce hit 4th behind Votto most the time. It may make a RHP starting pitcher think twice about pitching around Votto. I mean this year, as good as BP was with RISP, I still would make him beat me rather than Votto.

  15. Steve, Great post. That my favorite question and answer of the whole news conference. Price gave a great description of the team I want to see on the field.

    Interesting that Price used the 3 run late comeback as an example. The 2013 Reds were historically bad at comebacks, didn’t come back when down by 4 or more all season.

  16. I like the talk about unity, but my question is : “unified around what?” Are they unified as a collection of players who like each other or are they unified around core principles they believe will bring success? Judging from his remarks I think he meant the latter to a degree (although they may not like each other). Good managers use the press to send messages to their players. I think the purpose of his comments was to send the message that he’s in charge and players will tow the line or they will play somewhere else. If he brings a culture of accountability then the culture of the Dusty regime will go away. It may not be pretty, but I think that as fans we will like the result.

    • @Big_Red_Fan: One thing I think that might be part of the “Unity” part was how Baker went to the papers to get his way. Going to the papers in 2010 to get the front office to give him an extension before the team ever won anything. Going to the papers to demand a decision from the FO on Chapman. Going to the papers to essentially diss Devin last ST.

      What still kills me is Baker gets in Votto’s face when he just let out an F-bomb after striking out. But, then is just laughing at BP as BP goes on his tirade on the reporter. I just wonder how much Baker got in BP’s face about that.

  17. Obviously, i am in the minority here, everyone seems to love Price. I just see it as the Reds settling for someone cheap that they knew they could get. I hope he works out because I want to win, but I fear it wont. I listened to his PC and two radio interviews and the man is a bore with no personality.I also dont like that he didnt play major league baseball.

    I have stated I wanted Paul O’Neill. Paul is a winner. Trading him was a horrendous mistake by the Reds. I like that he would have brought what he learned with the Yankees to the Reds. it would have been great to bring him back. Also, he played Major League baseball, unlike Price.

    • @gschiller13: But, remember, also, you said you wanted someone with experience. O’Neill has no managing and coaching experience. Price have over 10 years of it. With experience, Price has O’Neill beat. Now, while O’Neill can flash his rings around. That doesn’t mean he would have any respect in the clubhouse with the players.

      Also, don’t forget, if I recall correctly, Sparky only had one year of big league ball himself, nothing ever great. Plenty of good coaches are made learning all they can while coming up. Making it to the bigs is more along the lines of things like:

      – Luck
      – God given physical gifts

      Not that these are the only things. For, everyone goes through the same training. But, those who have the luck and the physical gifts, also, they will make it. So, Price didn’t have the physical tools. But, it seems to me like he’s learned a lot of the training, though. I mean, just look at what he did with the pitching staff.

      I can understand what you are concerned with, though. But, most anyone we put in that place would worry someone. Unless we were to get someone like Showalter or Gibson or Hurdle or Sandberg, etc. Then, I would be willing to bet someone would still be worried. Even if no one is worried, no one can deny getting rid of Baker was a good move. And, only time will ultimately tell if bringing in Price was a good move. “As of now”, I do believe it is a good move.

      The only thing O’Neill would have probably learned from the Yankees is “You have to spend some more money to build the team”. It’s not like they were geniuses over there or something. Torre was considered an average manager at best, if I recall correctly, before taking over the Yankees.

    • @gschiller13: How much MLB experience did Sparky have? One season, basically a cup of coffee in the show. As far as personality goes, the two managers getting ready to square off in the WS are very “boring” but both have players that are not only talented but will run through walls for their teams.

      • @TC: I don’t know if he should be banned. The repetitive nature of the comments are on my nerves but he hasn’t personally attacked anyone. I think he has a right to speak his mind.

        Just my two cents.

        • @LWBlogger: At some point the deliberate repetativeness needs to be addressed, but if everyone would simply ignore the repeatative nuisance posts, he will either go away or cross the line beyond acceptable repetativeness.

    • @gschiller13: What if O’Neil would be interested in the hitting coach job? I think @eric nyc has asked that as well. I think the Reds will at least interview him to 1) gauge his interest and 2) figure out if he’s someone they may want in that role.

      O’Neil had a plan at the plate like so many Yankees during that time. I think he’d at least be worth talking to as a hitting coach if he has some interest.

  18. GREAT MOVE, I love the hire to get Bryan Price. That being said, we need a new hitting coach, the offense needs a new voice and a new approach. I want Eric Davis.

    Also, the Reds need to revamp the offense, 2 players they need target are:

    Jurickson Profar
    Nick Castellanos

    We have trade chips in Phillips, Bailey, Leake and Chapman.

    I would honestly call Detroit and offer them Phillips and Broxton for Castellanos and Rondon. Tigers have a need at 2B and a need for a PROVEN CLOSER. We would shed 71 M in payroll and get younger in 2 spots we need. Plus the Tigers have endless money.

    • @Josh: Josh
      I live in Dallas, there is no one on the Reds team the Rangers would give Profar up for. They want to use Profar to get Price or Stanton. They dont want Bailey.

  19. Just a few thoughts: I am a little nervous about pitching coaches who become managers, but he has had success as a pitching coach. It is Iobvious that his pitchers think he is great, but there is often a divide between pitchers and position players. None of this means he would fail here, but it does make me feel cautious. I guess that would be true of most guys who have been mentioned for this job, though.
    I wonder if Edgar Martinez would be interested in being a batting coach for the Reds?
    I wonder if anyone can teach Bruce where the outside corner is and get him to stop swinging at pitches that are off the outside corner. Maybe a manger who understands pitching will be able to explain to him the philosophy that is used to strike him out consistently.
    Can this team get back to running since the last couple of years they have been pretty bad?
    Who is the leader on this team, the guy who hates losing so much that it him up inside and makes him want to get on someone’s case when they mess up. Is there anyone available that would fit with the Reds?

  20. While Paul O Neill wold have been intriguing, Ray Knight and Bob Boone both managed the Reds and were AWFUL. Just because you were a pro doesn’t mean you can manage.

  21. I know I have read Billy Hamilton made a ton of errors playing at SS, but where was his problems? I’d think the guy could cover crazy range in the field with his speed. Was it turning the double play that would get him errors or just misjudgments in the field? Or was Hamilton’s issue with throwing from SS.

    • @earl: most of what i have read/heard was he has aninconsistent throwing motion to first causing throwing errors. Supposedly range and hands were “good to very good” but he just needed experience reps at SS. but likely all water under bridge now as Billy going to OF now.

  22. My $$ Money is with Sam Lecure. His name was mentioned more than any. This organization works from the top down. It was obvious from Bryan Price press conference. Put your $$ on Sam Lecure. He will be the next coach to come out of this group.

  23. The best part of the press conference, to me, were Walt’s comments about how there is a lot of work to be done this offseason. We all know Walt does his best work in the offseason, and this one should be no exception. I expect to see BP moved for sure, and possibly Homer. It would not shock me in the least to see us extending a qualifying offer to Bronson, and furthermore, I would welcome it. Most of us, myself included, have treated the jettisoning of Bronson as a forgone conclusion, but let’s be realistic. How many innings can we expect out of the trio of Cueto, Cingrani and Chapman? Right, I have no idea either, and we need at least 400 innings total out of the three of them. People are quick to want to trade from our pitching surplus ( I’ve been one of them at times), but your only have to think back to our former aces Jimmy Haynes and Ron Villone, to realize that we should probably hoard our pitching.

    Either way, I’m very excited to see how the offseason unfolds. I think hiring Price is a great first step, but. we’ll see.

    • @JMac1984: i agree it will be a busy off-season for Walt no matter what. Lots of items to address.

      BP trade or not. It will be interesting if we ever find out if Price defends keeping BP or agrees need to move BP.
      Chappy – another year of starter vs closer debate. or possible big chip in trade.
      Choo – my mind says unlikely signing but Walt has pulled off surprises before.
      Latos/Bailey/Leake/Cueto – all up for free agency next two years. Something HAS to happen here.
      CF – if not Choo, is it Billy or a trade/free agent
      LF – i guess worst case is a platoon of Ludwick/Xavier. Do Reds stay course with Ludwick given his contract/$$$$

      I think Bronson $$$ better used elsewhere. If you count Chapman, Reds will have 6 major league options for rotation at this time. Additionally, Reds will have 4 guys in AAA next year all with 350-500 minor league innings pitched to provide rotation depth. While only Corcino has been highly rated prospect till this year, the other 3 have been effective, surely Reds can get a #5 type performance if needed. then again maybe I am too optomistic about these guys.

      Go Reds 2014! :D

    • @JMac1984: Oooh. Hot stove. Love it.

      I LOVE the idea of bring back Arroyo if they can. Love it. Especially if they can’t get Choo and need to trade a pitcher. If they have to get to the market to get a pitcher, why not bring Bronson back?

      • @TC: No way I want to give Arroyo $10+ million over 3 years. I really love Bronson Arroyo and have loved watching him pitch for us. But he’s going to fall off a cliff any minute. He probably has at least one more solid year in him. But maybe not. And maybe he really does have 2 or 3. I hope he does because the guy is a great pro. But we’re solid enough with starting pitching that we don’t need to be the team that takes that risk. Cingrani is obviously ready to join the rotation full time and if Price makes the Chapman move we might already have too many big league starters without Arroyo.

        • @eric nyc: You’re probably right. As GM I would make entirely too many moves based on emotion. I am a huge Arroyo fan, I made a point to not miss watching a game that he pitched, so naturally I want him back.

      • @TC: Arroyo will cost the Reds either $14MM in a qualifying offer or $24MM in a 2 year contract. I think there are better and cheaper options available for the Reds who will fair better at GABP than Arroyo. I would like to have Arroyo back, but only at half the salary he will command as a FA. Arroyo’s BB/9 is excellent but that is more than offset by his LD% and SO/9. His GB% is good but that is more than offset by his HR/9. This is reflected in his ‘good’ Bronson & ‘bad’ Bronson results and I think he is teetering on the precipice of a sharp decline to ‘bad’ Bronson.

  24. I think there are some good things to notice from the press conference. First, he has a vision: be the team that nobody wants to play. Second, he has spelled out the qualities of the team that nobody wants to play: knock out starting pitchers before the 5th inning, aggressive base running, etc. My hope is that he will find the right staff that will get him there and that he will find the right measures to ensure that they are progressing in the right direction. That to me is what a manager does. I suppose it is nice to have a manager who has played in the big leagues when it comes to relating with players, but I don’t think that is necessary. Dusty was a long time big leaguer and I suspect that was his undoing — he too easily related with players. He wanted to be one of the guys. If Price can communicate his vision and get the players to buy in AND find the right measures to use, he will be successful.

  25. I am hearing that Ken Griffey is going to get a long look for hitting instructor/coach. Sr., not Jr. What was his approach in teaching in the minors at Bakersfield?? I know what he was like as a player, but I have no idea what his approach is as an instructor. Does he teach patience at the plate, or the previous hack away strategery??
    He did almost win a batting title in 1976 and had a near .300 lifetime average.

    • @WVRedlegs: I know the players he’s coached love him. Honestly, at this level, that’s what matters. These guys all “know” how to hit. It’s not like he’s teaching them how to swing a bat. It’s more about having a good relationship with them and being able to instill the offensive philosophy that the manager wants. I’d be good with Griffey. I’ve also said a few times that I think Paul O’Neil would be a great candidate. If he really wants to manage, it would be a great stepping stone for him and historically ex-players tend to make good hitting coaches. It’s a good position to bring in an iconic ex Reds player who can bring some fire to the clubhouse. Eric Davis is an option. Maybe even Larkin. The one knock on Price that I see is that he never played major league ball. I don’t think that’s THAT big of a deal, but it would be nice to have another guy in the dugout who the guys all know can relate to what they’re going through.

      • @eric nyc: I disagree with you, and I think that the hitting coach is actually an undervalued position in baseball right now. As good as Tiger Woods was in his prime at swinging a golf club, he still had a coach. Players can always improve their technique or learn new techniques based on circumstance, age, etc. Additionally, the advanced data hitters have on pitchers and tendencies are becoming more and more critical as more and more information is collected. Who gives that information to the hitters, helps the hitters prepare for the upcoming games, etc.?

        • @David: Yeah, we obviously see the value of a pitching coach. I think a hitting coach’s responsibilities are exactly the same from the other side of the game. Sort of like the differences between offensive and defensive coordinators.

        • @David: I totally agree with you on the advanced scouting part. That’s more valuable than the physical tweaking of a player’s swing that happens at the major league level. All I’m saying is that by the time a guy gets to the majors, his actual technique is probably pretty locked in. Yeah, some adjustments can be made, but they’re usually minor compared to when their working their way up. At the major league level the hitting coach is instilling a philosophy for the team, not really teaching hitting. I never meant to say it’s a meaningless position and just anyone can fill it – but it does seem to be a position that ex-players who were solid hitters seem to be able to take on with a lot of success.

        • @eric nyc: Things can change in a swing, but will the hitters change them. For instance, with Bruce, he showed a specific change this season in using more of the left side of the field. That’s a bit more than hitting philosophy but an actual change in how to hit that pitch. The hitter has to essentially change his timing and his stroke to be able to hit the inside part of the ball to make it go the opposite way.

          Now, making a ground ball hitter out of Stubbs, that probably wouldn’t ever happen. But, also, Ozzie Smith was an all-glove no-hit player first coming up. Then, he finished as a fairly decent hitter.

          It might just be how you said it, Eric. For, the hitting instructors definitely have a role on the team, if not a major role on the team. It’s just how good are they going to be, how much are the players going to listen, etc.

  26. Trade target for WJ:
    Delino Deshields, Jr., Astros 2B at the A+ level. Son of Dayton Dragons manager. Only 20 years old.

    • @WVRedlegs: It would be nice to pick up a prospect like DDJ, but Houston isn’t going to deal anyone, in my opinion. They’ve spent the last 3 seasons dealing ALL (other than Altuve) their current major league talent and have put all their eggs in the future prospects basket. No way they trade one away so they can put a major leaguer with a big salary on a losing team.

      • @prjeter:

        I didn’t say trade BP for him. I just said make this guy a target. His father is in the organization. Maybe somebody like Lutz or Tavieso could land him. The Astros had 4 players hit above .300 at their A+ team. DeShields was one of them. They had three more right around .280 on that same team. I think they could afford to let one hitter go to pick up a need in another area. DeShields should open up the 2014 season at AA. I don’t know what Houston’s depth is at 2B in their minors system. DeShields stole 51 bases last year. Pair him up with Hamilton, and then add in Ervin and you have some fleet footed players in the lineup to surround Votto, Bruce, Coz and Mes after 2014.
        I would really covet this guy to pair up with Hamilton. Just look at his slash line.

      • @prjeter:

        This is one summary on DeShields 2013 season from an Astros blog on their top 20 prospects. DeShields was the Astros 1st round pick in 2010. He stole 101 bases in 2012.
        “8) Delino DeShields, Jr., 2B, Grade B+: DDJ has had an interesting year. His stolen base numbers are down significantly, and his power has also taken a dip, despite playing in the notoriously hitter-friendly California League. The good news, however, is that he’s really improved his hit tool. Not only that, but his knowledge of the strike zone has also taken a step forward. The defense is still a bit iffy but he should be solid there, assuming he stays there in the long-term. High ceiling guy with some risk, will be interesting to see how he fits into the future plans. Could be a premium top of the order talent.”

        That last sentence sure peaks the interest. Th Reds have a big need in their organization for top of the order talent.
        Travieso is the Reds 1st round pick in 2012. Astros need more pitching. A trade of 1st round picks wouldn’t hurt either team. Would only help both. Reds could even afford to offer more than Travieso too.

      • @prjeter: Actually, wouldn’t Altuve be a pretty good guy to target if one were looking to replace Phillips? I have no idea what they would want for him but he’s two or three years in, i.e at or very close to arb eligible; and, they are probably further away from contending or even being competitive than their range of control of him.

  27. It would seem that a pitching coach would truly understand the need to have a consistent offense. If Price fixes anything, it’s to get the Reds ready to score runs early and keep their pitchers in the game through the 6th inning. He’s suggested that. Look for his hitting coach to be somebody very useful.

  28. HOLY COW!! Did anyone else hear that interview with Walt Jocketty by Bill Cunningham on WLW at 1:15 this afternoon?

    That was GREAT stuff!!!

    • @TC: I LOVE Walt Jocketty. Almost every question we could have ever had was answered in that interview. I hope that interview is written about by the beat writers.

      • @Matt WI:

        Cunningham did not pull punches and asked the tough questions the beat writer would not dare attempt if they wanted to keep their press passes.

        Summary:
        – Brian Price is private and smart about it, but he can be tough on guys. He won’t be picking up and throwing 1B any time soon.
        – They will be trying to change the hitting philosophy to “grind out” ABs and bringing in guys who have that philosophy. They will be enforcing the new philosphy.
        – (Here was a big one) Votto needs to start hitting like a #3 and start driving the ball again or they will move him in the order.
        – The role of Chapman is being discussed and will be changing. He will not be “only” the 9th inning guy. He will be getting more innings.
        – They, with BC’s blessing, will be competing hard to resign Choo.
        – They will be making a lot of changes this winter in personnel both with coaching and players.
        – (I’m reading between the lines, but it wasn’t hard to do.) They will be getting a new hitting coach.
        – Brian will pick his own pitching coach who echos his style and philosophy.
        – WJ cannot watch the Cardinals anymore because he’s sick of watching them win. (lol)
        – While they haven’t been actively shopping Phillips, the interview and C Trent incidents were a “huge mistake” that they will have to take a look at.

        I am NOT doing this justice. There are other things, but they aren’t coming to mind at the moment. WJ was a candid as I’ve ever heard him. Bill was Bill and pressed him on A LOT of tough questions. I doubt WJ will come back to Cunningham’s show after that tough interview.

        • @TC:

          Cunningham did not pull punches and asked the tough questions the beat writer would not dare attempt if they wanted to keep their press passes.

          With the caveat if Dusty was still managing the Reds. I don’t think Bryan Price will be nearly as sensitive or antagonistic regarding questions and criticism. While not particularly dynamic, Price presents a more open and honest persona.

        • @TC:

          I doubt WJ will come back to Cunningham’s show after that tough interview.

          I didn’t think WJ received any question he wasn’t anticipating and he didn’t dodge any question. I think the forum provided by Cunningham (and I think he is way over-the-top) provided the perfect platform for WJ to answer the questions everyone wanted asked. I particularly enjoyed the interchange when Cunningham offered his personal advise to WJ regarding specific coaching changes.

        • @Shchi Cossack: I think you’re right that Walt knew the content of the interview before going on the air and wasn’t blindsided by anything, but that doesn’t detract from just how revealing he was. I’ve never heard Walt be that candid about ANYTHING. Saying what he said about Votto and Phillips on the air? That’s huge. I think this was a really calculated PR move. The Dusty/Walt organization has been famously tight lipped. Dusty brushed off any question about his managerial decisions. Walt is famously tight lipped about his dealings. It’s been a source of frustration for the fanbase, especially after such a disappointing season like this past one. Firing Dusty, hiring Price, all the other moves that will be made – a lot of them are being done to placate the fans. This interview was a step towards that.

        • @TC: A great and entertaining interview but more importantly, INFORMATIVE. Could not be any more excited about 2014 after hearing Walt’s thoughts. Go Reds Go.

        • @TC: Listening now… I like the part where where Jocketty doesn’t use the word “urgency” but he specifically stated “we let some games go early in the season that I thought ‘this is going to hurt us later, and it did'” I think it comes pretty clear that the majority Redleg Nation read on the Walt/Dusty relationship was largely on target.

    • @TC: OMG :!: What an absolutely great interview. WJ may play everything close to the vest, but when he answers a question, he doesn’t pull punches and his answers are forthright. Reds fans have every reason to be optimistic going forward.

      • @Shchi Cossack: I had no idea that Walt and the word “fun” could go together… but that was an entertaining interview and it actually sounded as if he enjoyed himself. Huh. The muzzle is off, no reason to protect organizational reputation while Dusty is running his own agenda.

    • @TC: Wow…Listening now. The stuff about Votto needing to change his approach or be taken out of the 3 spot is huge. He basically said that Votto wasn’t listening to the coaches who were telling him he needed to stop being so passive. This could get interesting…

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