A possibility of a sweep? Really?
Even better, it’s the good type of sweep, not that bad sweep the Reds suffered last weekend at the hands of the Royals.
Afternoon game today with lefty Matt Maloney going for the Reds again. He’s been pretty good in his first two starts; let’s hope for more of the same today. Discuss it here!

Same two clowns in the 1 and 2 spots today. Takes a bigger clown to keep sending them out there.
Here’s the lineup. At least Hannigan has moved up a little. Still the same ol 1-2 punch (in the gut). Why will he not play Dickerson, Janish or Gomes?
REDS
Taveras 8
Gonzalez 6
Phillips 4
Nix 7
Hanigan 2
Bruce 9
Hairston 5
Rosales 3
Maloney 1
No Dickerson? What is it going to take???
That lineup is disgusting. It’s the same lineup as last night, basically, but Maloney ain’t hittin’ a three run home run.
Seriously…if I bought tickets for that game and I showed up and I saw that line up posted, I’d march down to the first row and give Dusty a piece of my mind.
What would he do with it?
I’m glad to see Hernandez get a day off. Maloney better be near perfect, though.
I thought for sure we’d get a Dicerson Janish start today… Haha… It’s a shame that I’d be happier with Dickerson Janish start to the order.
Looks like Baker is letting Cox fill out his lineup card….
Here’s what I would do:
Dickerson – cf
Hanigan – c
Phillips – 2b
Nix – lf
Gomes – 1b
Bruce – rf
Hairston – 3b
Janish – ss
pitcher
In June, Owings has had more plate appearances than Janish.
WHY, DUSTY? WHY!!!!!??!?!
At least give me Gomes. I’m not sold on Hanigan being a #2 guy though. Maybe throw Janish up there. Perhaps Dusty’s grand strategy is to get them as many ABs as possible to get them back in the swing of things. Scarrrrry.
Well let’s hope we get lucky with 3-8, and that Maloney has a helluva game.
WE MISS YOU JOEY VOTTO!!!
This is beyond belief. He is going to hit Taveras first until he gets two hits in a game or dies, whichever happens first.
AnnapolisRed: I’ve never wished death upon anyone, but maybe… you know, *wink*
Repost from what I said in the other thread: I thought the possibility existed that Owings went out (of the rotation at least) when Volquez returned if Maloney pitched well. But I think Owings has shown enough the last few starts to retain his position.
This is deja vu all over again. We went all the way down with Patterson last year, lets do it again this year with Taveras. The best part…Taveras will be here next year also.
Big batch of rain moving through.
I was reading the box score from yesterday on the potty this morning, when Dusty finally made sense. He puts Hanigan at the bottom of the lineup cause that is where all the hits come from. He would be wasted at the top behind Taveras, duh.
With the right manager the Taveras signing wasn’t a horrible move (not great either), but with Toothpick making the lineup everyday, it scared the crap out of me, and this is exactly why.
For a legit playoff team Gonzalez isn’t even in the lineup, let alone batting #2.
Andy, regardless of manager, a 2-yr guaranteed contract to Taveras after the season he had didn’t and still doesn’t make any sense.
What are the worst contracts the Reds have ever signed? Taveras has to be up there, along with Eric Milton.
This is deja vu all over again. We went all the way down with Patterson last year, lets do it again this year with Taveras. The best part…Taveras will be here next year also.
During his Chicago years, Baker didn’t always go with the speedy/SB/no-OBP guy in the top of the lineup until his last season (Pierre). In fact, his lineup often had the higher OBP few SB guy batting leadoff:
>Mark Grudzielanek in 2003 (until they got Lofton)
>Todd Walker & Grudz in 2004 for 81 games, Patterson for
55. Patterson was 24 at the time and had a .839 OPS
the year before.
>A merry-go-round of misfits in 2005 who couldn’t get the job done.
Patterson started here but was as bad as he was in Cincy in 2009.
Hairston had the most appearances at leadoff (76).
His Obp the previous 2 yrs in Baltimore was 353 & 378,
but could only muster a 336 for Chicago
>2006 saw Pierre at leadoff for 159 games. 330 OBP. His
previous 6 years OBP (from 2000-2005) was, 353, 378,
332, 361, 374, 326.
“It’s the best lineup I could come up with,” manager Dusty Baker said Thursday morning.
Really? This is the best lineup Dusty could come up with?
Thanks Greg, that is interesting stuff.
But if that is the case, what is going on here? Just stubborness?
Ramrod, I’m curious as to why you wouldn’t try Hanigan in the #2 hole? .396 OBP, less K’s than walks..what do you want out of a #2?
Offensively, he’s tons better than Janish.
The only thing I can’t figure out about Hanigan (and it’s not really about him, but the opposition) is when are they going to figure out you can’t run on this kid?
Jimmy James – That comment just makes me angry about the Cincinnati media’s lack of intestinal fortitude. They all know it’s not the best lineup, but no one is willing to call Dusty on it.
As for Taveras…
“Hopefully the people stick with him a little longer,” Baker said. “The razzing and stuff doesn’t help at all. I can understand it but it doesn’t help. It actually makes its worse.”
No, Dusty, what makes it worse is that you continue to play him. He can’t hit.
My only reservation on Hannigan in the 2 spot would be the whole slow catcher, increased chance of double plays thing. I am not sure that is entirely true in this case, and given the other candidates and the way Hannigan has been getting on base I would give it a short.
short=shot. Sigh.
Baker said that Hernandez would likely catch at least a couple of games this weekend vs. the White Sox since he’s a former American Leaguer with the Orioles and A’s.
“He knows those guys better than anybody that we have here,” Baker said.
Perhas Hernandez could, you know, share all that knowledge with Ryan Hanigan prior to the game. That way we could keep one of the 2 or 3 players actually hitting the ball in the lineup.
GRF,
The leadoff batter has to actually get on base for Hanigan to hit into a double play.
It got to a point last season I actually felt sorry for Patterson. You knew he was trying, you knew he knew he was playing horribly and heard the boos and yet Dusty would keep putting him out there to fail.
Really Dusty, do NOT put the blame on us for critizing guys you insist on putting in these situations.
Bill: Statistically you’re right, he fits the mold. But with the way the bottom of the order has been, I like the idea of having him lower to knock in some runs if we get some walks to the sluggers. Basically in THIS lineup, if Baker is insisting on having struggling bats at the top of the order, I like Hanigan further down.
Ideal lineup for me RIGHT now would be:
CF Dickerson
C Hanigan
2B Phillips
LF Nix / Gomes (Dependent on pitcher obviously)
RF Bruce
1B Hernandez
3B Hairston
SS Janish / Gonzo
So basically I do like Hanigan as a #2, just not with the lineup we’re throwing out there.
Agree CP
I agree, GRF. Patterson busted his tail trying to play well.
The difference this year is that I don’t think Taveras is putting forth the same effort. Frankly, I’d rather have Patterson (I can’t believe I just typed that). At least you always knew Patterson was trying. I don’t think we can assume that with Taveras, based on some of the lackadaisical play we’ve seen from him in the outfield.
I was at the game last night, joking with the person who went with me that for the Reds now, “turning over the lineup” means getting through the #2 hitter and starting an inning with Brandon Phillips.
Enough bashing on Taveras – that point is so obvious that only a complete idiot would argue it.
Alex Gonzalez is probably the least well equipped person on the Reds to bat second. Terrible plate discipline, looks at few pitches, doesn’t hit the other way, etc. He’s also in a season long slump – incredibly, his average has never been above .225 or OBP above .270.
Despite that, five games ago Dusty decided that AGon would bat second because he was “swinging a hot bat” for a couple of games in Washington. Over those five games AGon has batted .137.
Question: how much longer will Dusty insist this was the right move?
Pre-game gripe is officially over. Go Reds, sweep Braves.
I listened to Thom B.’s pregame interview with Dusty today. Thom usually spends the entire broadcast on the radio complaining about every player on the team – to the point where I have to turn the sound down.
So I was looking forward to him asking Dusty a tough question or two today. But then we he gets to actually ask a pointed question he lobs “Gee Dusty, isn’t this the best pitching staff you’ve ever had?” and “Gee Dusty, you sure do have to manage every game all game long, don’t you?”.
Sheesh. Too many members of the media here are afraid to challenge Dusty.
Not a single question about Taveras or Gonzalez, or playing time for Dickerson or Janish.
How about: “Why are you continuing to bat the two worst hitters on the team in the top two spots?”
How about: “Considering his recent defensive lapses, his inability to draw a walk in his last 60 plate appearances, his batting average of below .100 for his last 80 at bats, do you feel Willy Taveras has hurt the Reds this past month and how much longer will you continue to play him and bat him first?”
Or: “Five games ago you moved Alex Gonzalez to the second position in the lineup, despite his year long slump, low on base percentage, poor plate discipline, and inability to hit the opposite way. Your reasoning was that he was swinging a hot bat over a couple of games in Washington. Since then, he has batted .157. How much longer are you going to continue that failed experiment, given that Gonzalez seems so ill-suited for the role otherwise?”
Ask the questions the fans want answered.
And, Go Reds!! Sweep the Braves!!
Another bad throw from JHJ. He has an incredibly inaccurate arm. Paul Janish would be solid there.
I predict a hit, a steal and a score.
Even if you accept that Taveras is our regular CF and Gonzo is our regular SS (because Dusty says so), it doesn’t make sense to play them today, a day game after a nite game, for multiple reasons. Gonzo is an aging SS with a bad knee, and Taveras could obviously use a mental day off (no confidence at bat or in CF).
Further, Dickerson and Janish, even if they aren’t the regular starters, need to play sometimes to keep sharp, or at this point to get sharp. Dusty says he likes to get all his position players some starts.
He’s not doing that, it’s just crazy.
I’m glad that Ramon H. is getting a day off.
Two soft groundball outs for Taveras and Gonzalez. What futility.
Okay, Steve you are right. I am an idiot.
Agreed pinson343. Just from a pure “keeping players sharp” standpoint both Dickerson and Janish should play today.
Jimmy: no one would be happier than I would be if Taveras and Gonzalez became .300 hitters. It’s just looking now like they won’t, so how much longer should we suffer through this “gotta get them going” phase? Why not work on getting Dickerson going, or Janish going, or Stubbs going?
Because the Reds failed at accomplishing their off-season moves such that Taveras and Hernandez ended up being the two big splashes. So the Reds have an incentive to stick with them much longer than warranted by their play.
UGH… 1-0 bad guys
At least David Ross is up.
Well, the Reds should be able to score at least two runs today…but Maloney better not give up any more runs with the Reds pathetic offense behind him if he hopes to win.
Who is more likely to drive in runs, Maloney or Taveras?
Feel free to stick an elbow over the plate Willie.
Come on Willy, just once, get a hit (or even a walk).
Taveras (and Dusty for hitting him first) is killing the Reds offense. If I was in the stadium this afternoon I’d be booing right now. Not booing Willy, booing Dusty.
A foot outside…
ugh.
UGH! ;-(
Swinging on a ball a foot outside. I believe Charlie Brown put it best ARRRGh!
62 plate appearances for Taveras without a walk. That has to be the longest streak in the major leagues.
Boo, Dusty, you’re hurting this team.
Hey guys. Off topic, and very trivial, but this has been bugging me.
There’s a sports radio host here in New York that keeps calling Johnny Bench, *John* Bench when referring to him. e.g. “Jorge Posada is no John Bench.”
I have never heard him called John, always Johnny. So just wondering if any of you guys have ever heard that?
Dusty must be fuming right now, the Reds have no hits and still somehow managed to clog the bases… He probably wonders what else he can do (you know, besides batting Taveras and Gonzales first and second all the time) to keep those bases unclogged.
hammer1: I’ve been a Reds fan dating back through the Big Red Machine era and I can say I don’t remember anyone – fans, announcers, teammates – ever referring to him as John. Maybe Sparky did occasionally.
Maloney is dealing (again).
I heard the last inning in the car radio. Sounded like Maloney had a better at-bat than Taveras.
I’ve been impressed with Phillips improved plate discipline so far this year. He has as many bb’s as K’s and his bb/ab ratio is greater than 10%.
Yeah me too Steve, and I never heard it either.
I was just curious if it was maybe a local thing in Cincinnati or what.
It does sound like something Sparky could of said a time or two though.
Thanks for the reply.
Ugh. Arrrrgh. Fiddlesticks.
baserunner erased
Phillips has now stolen 8 but been caught 5 times. Not good.
Phillips trying to do too much again.
Greg, you heard correctly.
Diaz, Homerun X(
phillips thinks he has to steal enough bases to make up for the entire top of the line up
This team can’t hit anybody much, but especially struggling young pitchers.
They get themselves in trouble, we get them out of trouble with inept hitting and baserunning mistakes, they eventually settle down.
Philipps no doubt gets frustrated at coming to bat time after time with noone on base. But he needs to cool it. Stealing second was good, from there give the hitters behind you a chance.
5 for his last 56 and not only does he still lead off but he’s still starting every day and on the roster
a .200 OPS FOR A MONTH!
UGH! X(
sorry I got that wrong 5 for 66
4 nothing might as well be 4,000 to nothing without Micah in to bash in some runs.
4-0 is too much for our offense.
4 – 0 = insurmountable lead !!!! =(
Taveras has that many hits (5)in his last 66 ABs ? And how many walks in that time, 1 or 0 ?
Miracles do happen, but this is looking like a rout in the making.
We should be pinch hitting for Maloney right now – we need four runs. Can’t give up this out. The bullpen is plenty rested.
Once again, the bottom of the lineup performing. Pressure on Willy T now.
Well, great – we have two on and WILLY TAVERAS is coming up. How pathetic that we have our lead off hitter bunting in this situation, when we need four runs. Sadly he couldn’t even get a bunt down – despite what George Grande says, he is a terrible bunter. Weak pop up.
How many more crucial AB is Dusty going to waste?
BOOOOOO!
Thom coins new nickname for Taveras – .0
Thom Brennaman is giving it to Willy T
The Cowboy just asked, “Is Chris Dickerson still on this team?”
Can’t even lay down a bunt. Totally useless. This is on Dusty.
“Is Chris Dickerson still on this team?” – Jeff Brantley
Thom B. is so critical now of Taveras, but when he had the chance to ask Dusty before the game about it, he rather would ask “Gee Dusty, we’ve had a lot of rain lately, haven’t we?”
Another rally totally killed by our #1 and #2 “hitters”. Dusty’s line up is killing us.
Point Zero and his sidekick Alex GONEzales keep on keeping on doing nothing.
Un-freaking-believable!!!
how about that sports fans?!?!?! 1st and 2nd, nobody out …. after the one & two batters – 1st and 2nd , 2 outs !!!! what a freakin joke !!!!! forget willy , bench dusty !!!!
The top two in the lineup have killed two rallies, this game could be close. And it’s so predictable.
Here I am, looking forward to afternoon baseball, and this is what we’re treated to. Thanks Willy, thanks Dusty.
Can you imagine if George Steinbrenner was the owner of the Reds with this Taveras-Gonzalez BS going on? Dusty would be a dead man.
As for media not asking Dusty the tough questions, Marty Brennaman and Hal McCoy should have their MLB Hall of Fame credentials revoked.
Back to the decision not to pinch hit for Maloney last inning. The Reds got lucky and he was safe on a fielder’s choice. But…
He had thrown 89 pitches, so probably looking at only one more inning pitched – hardly make or break for our bullpen.
We have THIRTEEN freaking pitchers on the roster. Yes we threw four relievers last night, but we have four others we didn’t use.
Why in the world wouldn’t you pinch hit for Maloney in that circumstance?
Doesn’t this happen every year? I feel like us few are the only ones watching the games. If there isn’t some kind of move by Sunday/Monday that helps the offense I don’t know what to think. Bring up someone! I can’t stand Taveras. Why doesn’t Dickerson get any chance in center??
Y-City: Good point on the media laying down for Dusty. It’s especially inexcusable for the ones who don’t work for the Reds. I guess they see themselves as reporters (of the Reds vanilla viewpoint) instead of journalists.
You might also be able to make a case that the Breneman’s don’t want to rock the boat because they are employees of the Reds. BUT, if that’s the case, why do they spend their broadcasts attacking the Reds players?
Hal McCoy won’t ever attack Dusty because they get along so well personally and Hal feels like he has great access to Dusty. He has always clouded those two issues: “Dusty is a good manager because he is friendly to the press.”
But if anyone has the stature and independence to ask Dusty tough questions, it’s Hal.
***please note that Dusty just took Maloney out of the game in the middle of the inning – so why in the world wouldn’t you have pinch hit for him before, four runs behind???
Heck, I think even Marge Schott would’ve know better at this point.
You think we can get Eric Davis to suit up this weekend? Heard he’ll be in town for the festivities.
exactly what i’m screaming steve !!! why let him hit, then pull him mid inning ??? nothing dusty does makes any sense at all
Do you think we could Bette Davis to suit up this weekend?
I heard she can bunt.
and she’s got a good eye(s)
In a somewhat similar mindset of the George Grande Drinking Game, I think we could develop a health improvement game based on how often the dynamic duo of Taveras-Gonzalez get on base. It could be a diet game where you get to eat a meal every time they get on base. It would be a real hit with anorexics. Other options would be a quit smoking program where one could light every time they get on base. The list could go on with alcoholic/drug rehab, nymphomania, etc.
Two F’n hits and one of them turned into a picked off baserunner.
Offense – Frustrating
Dusty – Incomprehensible
i suggest the opposite ! take a drink / smoke / eat a meal everytime they don’t get on base …. maybe when dusty sees people dropping dead, he will make a change
Forget Marge, Schottzie would have known better.
Now I know what Marge meant the last time Schottzie defecated at the ball park and Marge said “Look, you made a center fielder.” The woman could see things….
LOL Y-City, except for the nymphomania suggestion. No need to stop a good woman from her calling.
0-for-6 from the #1-2 batters so far today.
I could resist adding nymphomania. I figured it would be a first for Redleg Nation.
I’m blocked from every other sport site. Can someone give an occasional update on the score?
7-0 Braves
The Reds have 3 hits.
They just started the bottom of the 7th inning.
Braves reliever Moylan in for starter Hanson.
Dickerson sighting as he is in to PH for the pitcher’s spot. And he promptly singles to centerfielder, bringing Taveras to the plate.
Point Zero strikes again!
base hit chris dickerson !!!! he has as many hits today as taveras has all month !!!!!
stolen base!! what more does he have to do dusty????
Top of the order strikes again!
Everyone has games like this, it is just the lineup thing that makes this so frustrating.
Nice to see Dickerson, even just pinch hitting. Maybe he stays in?
0 for 8 !!!! way to go …. think dusty will pull the double switch w/ c.dickerson??
date his daughter
Thom B is suggesting that Baker gets upset and talks down to anyone (reporters) that suggest lineup changes.
that’s cause dusty aint no front runner , fool !!!
C-Dick with more hits in 1 at-bat than Taveras & Gonzalez in 8 (so far) today.
For the Atlanta series:
Dickerson 2-for-2 with a stolen base.
Taveras & Gonzalez 2 for 26 (so far) and a stolen base for Taveras.
I am very close to not watching or listening to another Reds games until something is done about Dusty and his stubbornness with his starting lineup and batting orders.
I simply can’t watch something so obviously idiotic
last night I started writing my letter to Reds ownership.
Taveras should be benched if not released
Gonzo should be benched if not released
yet they bat 1-2 and the team can’t score runs
not even people who can’t add think those two should be batting 1-2
I would love to 5 minutes with Dusty. I want to know what the hell his justification is for throwing away games this way. I want to know if he thinks Willy is going to start hitting? Honestly WHAT THE #@$%#$^% IS THIS MAN THINKING?
if anyone in the media is reading this. YOUR TO BLAME. Stop being such lapdogs
The worst part is that we’re facing lefties this weekend vs the ChiSox. So, you know nothings going to change for now.
now dusty has gotten janish and dickerson in the game, so he can tell us stupid fans to stfu!!
Yeah, well none of you played with Hank Aaron.
not true river city — gomes will play instead of nix !!
And supposedly Hanigan is going to ride some pine this weekend while Hernandez catches a few games.
So, down by 7 runs in the 8th inning, DB feels it’s safe to bring in Janish and rest his start SS.
This game did not have to be a rout. Hanson could not find the strike zone early, loading the bases without our getting a hit. So who do we have up with the bases loaded ? Inning over. Then thanks to a break, we have two on and none out, and who comes up but the dynamic duo.
If Dickerson were leading off and a decent hitter batting second, this game might have gone in a completely different direction.
UGH!!!
You know I was down on Dickerson when he was starting over Nix in LF. Fast foward into this season. Dickerson is CLEARLY a better choice in CF than Tavaras. Hands down…no argument. I don’t understand what Dusty’s thinking is on this.
According to GameDay, WT’s last out was a line drive. So that will give him at least another week as our leadoff “hitter”.
Actually according to GameDay, we hit a few line drives right at somebody today. So Dusty will figure we just couldn’t catch a break.
Why is Atlanta using their closer tandem in a 7-0 game?
cause they haven’t pitched in a week
Fitting that Taveras strikes out to end the game.
C-Dick with more hits in 1 at-bat than Taveras & Gonzalez in 9 today. 0-for-9 with 3 strikeouts.
For the Atlanta series:
Dickerson 2-for-2 with a stolen base.
Taveras & Gonzalez 2 for 27 and a stolen base for Taveras.
Willy T ends the game in style !
Actually, if he got a hit at that point, it would have been even more annoying.
as I think Steve pointed out the other day
the Red to get an extra plate appearance today because of where he bats in the lineup?
Taveras
Since May 24th Taveras is an amazing 4 for 61 for an OPS (not AVG, not OBP) under .175!
During that span the Reds have lost 6 games by 3 runs or less. 2 of those by 1 run
He woulda gotten a standing O from the crowd (what was left of them).
Quick, someone get Baker a Taveras baseball card!
532 PA in 2008 308obp/296slg – 604ops
236 PA in 2009 (before today’s game) 276obp/281slg – 557ops
And they’re hurting for money to sign players in the offseason or to trade for a player during the season because of over $10M in sunk costs to Taveras and Lincoln.
Well, at least they took 2 out of three in the series and Votto, EE and Volquez are closer to getting back to the club.
Just one more reminder about the options the Reds have
Lance Nix can play CF. He’s not horrible at it either
Imagine his .841 OPS in CF!?!?
You can’t have three lefties in the outfield?! Are you crazy!!?
if having the best players on the field is crazy, then yes, I’m crazy
one more odd thing I wondered about today’s lineup
so Hanigan has been hitting well enough to move ahead of Bruce in today’s lineup but he’s not hitting well enough (also in spite of his makeup, not slow for a catcher, makes contact, gets on base, but doesn’t hit for power) to bat #2 instead of the two-headed-monster?
Speed is more important defensively (and only in certain positions at that) than offensively. Adam Dunn was no speed demon but he certainly was a run scoring one.
Hitting in the #2 spot would put some pressure on a young kid in his first year in the bigs. Maybe Hanigan could handle it but I think Dusty’s going to say its too soon in Hanigan’s career to try it.
Hanigan hasn’t chilled and marinated enough to bat 2nd.
I’m thinking the same thing.
From the Enquirer after today’s game:
“Baker has used different combinations, different lineups.”
Moving Gonzalez up in the lineup and Bruce down in the lineup doesn’t count as effective
“I don’t think I can shake up anymore than I already have,” he said. “I’ve been shaking it up all year long. You shake it up and most of the time you get the same results.”
That’s the spirit, doesn’t matter what I do, it’ll just turn out the same. How about batting Hanigan higher in the lineup, how about benching Taveras for Dickerson, how about giving Janish a shot, that sounds more like a shakeup to me.
“That’s the odd stat on Taveras: Despite all his struggles, the Reds are 28-21 with him in the leadoff role.”
I think it would be better worded 28-21 in spite of Taveras batting leadoff
Baker dropped him to second in order for two games. Would he consider dropping him further?
“I don’t know,” Baker said. “You’re asking me questions I haven’t had time to think about. The problem is I had Jerry leading off and he wasn’t getting on either.”
Haven’t had time to think about it? What the hell, you’re the manager of a Major League baseball team. It’s your job to think about it, when you don’t you aren’t earning your paycheck.
Sorry but IMHO, it has become time for Dusty to go.
Just now? He needed to go last year after batting leadoff all the way down to .200
Patterson…I meant to say Patterson
I meant to say that his comments are infuriating and he should have been let go a long time ago.
“That’s the odd stat on Taveras: Despite all his struggles, the Reds are 28-21 with him in the leadoff role.”
You gotta be kidding me. Are they for real putting out garbage like this?
free drew stubbs!
Willy Taveras –
Total Since May 15th 8-94 0.085
in June 1-42 .024
Michael Jordan had better June’s and I’m talking about baseball.
Another odd stat, the Reds are one game over .500 with Ryan Hanigan playing catcher, while batting 8th in the lineup. No word out yet if a shake up is needed to increase the team’s effectiveness while he catches.