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ESPN column on Dusty and Youth:
Jim Leyland craves nicotine. Tony La Russa is autocratic. Lou Piniella is a walking Vesuvius. And Dusty Baker, when he’s not subjecting young pitchers to overly onerous workloads, is supposedly a “veteran’s guy.”
Not true, claims Baker, who insists this bogus notion was concocted by a San Francisco radio critic — the same guy who was fired for saying that former Giants manager Felipe Alou had Cream of Wheat for brains. Baker calls the rap against him “asinine,” along with an eight-letter word that begins with “bull.”
“When I came up to the big leagues, I had Hank Aaron not only telling me what to do, but showing me what to do, and that was a blessing,” Baker said. “I always yearned for a team full of young kids so I could teach them how to play.”
As much as I believed that Dusty was the wrong manager for this team and abhor the mistakes he’s made (and continues to make [i.e. Corey Patterson]), he’s been much better with the Reds young players than I ever expected him to be and better then the previous managers have been.
After seven straight losing seasons, the Reds are reaping the benefits of a farm system that has vaulted from 29th to third place in the Baseball America talent rankings. Former general manager Wayne Krivsky, who was fired in April and replaced by Walt Jocketty, did his part to ensure continuity with several astute moves.
True, Krivsky gave out some bad smaller contracts to the likes of Corey Patterson, Mike Stanton and Juan Castro. But he also picked up Phillips, shortstop Jeff Keppinger and reliever Jared Burton for next to nothing, and he acquired Hamilton in the Rule 5 draft and spun him into a deal for Volquez.
Even the trade for which Krivsky was most vilified — Austin Kearns and Felipe Lopez to Washington for bullpen help — is looking much better in hindsight. Lefty Bill Bray has pitched well in relief, and starter Daryl Thompson, 5-2 with a 1.55 ERA in the minors, could be on the verge of joining Volquez, Johnny Cueto and Bailey as youthful sidekicks to Aaron Harang in the rotation.
He doesn’t mention the other contracts eaten, like Cormier.
I don’t agree with downplaying the wasted money to Patterson, Stanton, and Castro because on smaller market teams, you can’t afford signings like these. Not when players with this value can be had for major league minimum.
Also, in retrospect, though now it does look like the trade is going to fall in the Reds favor, I will never be convinced that Krivsky knew that Lopez and Kearns careers were going to drop to the depths that they have. More importantly, the intent of the trade was to improve the team to win at that time, which it did not do.
And on Dunn…
The biggest decisions this winter will revolve around the corner outfield spots, at which Griffey has a $16.5 million club option awaiting him and Dunn is eligible for free agency.
There are legitimate reasons to think the Reds might hang on to Dunn. Owner Bob Castellini is a Dunn admirer, and it wouldn’t make a lot of sense for the Reds to sever ties with Dunn only to turn around and pursue a Raul Ibanez, Bobby Abreu or Pat Burrell. Dunn has averaged 41 homers and 100 RBIs per season the past four years and has a career on-base percentage of .382. You just don’t replace that kind of production overnight.
The contrasting view is that Dunn might be ready for a change of scenery at 28. He took an emotional hit when the Reds traded his buddy Kearns to Washington, and he’s grown tired of the trade rumors that have swirled around him in recent years. Sources say that Dunn also was less than thrilled last year when Bill Cunningham, a local radio provocateur who works for the Reds’ flagship station, said Dunn played left field as if he were “drunk,” and the club didn’t exactly rush to his defense.
Dunn told the Reds that if he were going to sign an extension, it would have to be during spring training. That failed to materialize, and he’s not interested in renewing talks or hashing out what-if scenarios now.
“I worry about all that stuff when the time is right,” Dunn said, “and right now the time isn’t right.”
I had not heard that Dunn had put a deadline on signing an extension or that he’s not interested in talking now. The local quotes have always been that the Reds had not contacted him. An admitted Dunn fan, I hope that the change in management and Castellini’s reported desire to keep Dunn in town will convince him to change his mind.
But I have to admit, if he’s not willing to talk now, they have to look to move him after his non-trade runs out this month. They can’t afford for him to walk and only get a draft pick for him. IMO, the Reds management is in a bad position here. There is not a wealth of offense in the minor league organization, Dunn’s offense is consistent and will not be easy to replace, and as the article states, it doesn’t make any sense to move Dunn and then go into free agency to try to replace him.
It’s easy to blame Krivsky for not talking to Dunn about an extension, but if Castellini is really a Dunn fan, he could have ordered him to open negotiations.
The prospect of losing Dunn scares me, quite honestly. What looks to be a good 2009 season seems to be more of the same without Dunn in the picture.
It’s just too bad that the WLW dittoheads are killing the chances of signing him to a longterm deal. Maybe we all should start going to the games with signs that say “Sign Dunn to a longterm contract!”
The only way you could afford to trade Dunn is if you can fleece a team like the A’s did on the Dan Haren deal. I don’t see that happening, so they need to resign him sooner rather than later.
Another reason to despise some of the guys on the radio. If we would have listened to them we would have Joe Blanton sitting at 3-8 with no Homer Bailey, no Votto, and we would be missing another prospect. Maybe I am too much of a fanatic about it, but I am so tired of some of these knuckleheads in radio getting down on our guys. I would also like to say it isn’t all of them that bother me just the ones that refuse to use logic when they talk.
I like Dunn, so don’t take this the wrong way…. but I would look to move him regardless. He is going to want at least 4 years of at least 15 million dollars. He doesn’t want to play first base and there is no way a team with our payroll can put forward 15 million a year or more for a terrible fielding left fielder. Dunn is a valuable player, but his value comes from his bat and his glove negates some of that and odds are at his age he is just going to get worse defensively with time. If he would sign for 3 years at 13 million or so, I would be all over it. But he is going to want more and for longer and I just couldn’t do it.
I agree, Dunn is going to price himself out of Cincinnati and then whoever signs him is going to have a $15 – $16 million dollar paperweight on the back end of his contract.
There’s no evidence that Baker is wearing out young players, especially pitchers.
Baker can take a hit for playing Patterson, but not for signing him, or any of the other deals that some folks criticize.
As for Dunn, his market price is obvious. The Reds either pay that, or they lose his offense. They should pay him.
As for bill Cunningham… well, he’s a good reason to turn off your radio.
I’d be all for signing Dunn, no questions, except I can’t get past the fact that I can count on one hand the number of long-term contracts the Reds have done that actually worked out for the best.
Instead, they usually result in drastically lowered production or suddenly the player becomes an injury-plagued albatross on the payroll. In fact, you could probably say this about most teams and long-term deals. Been happening for years, and every year people seem surprised when a guy like Barry Zito tanks.
Dunn has shown no signs of becoming injury prone or forgetting how to play baseball. But throw $15 million at him and who knows. That’s what holds me back from saying, “Sure!” and it’s not even my money.
The Reds at 21-20 since firing Krivsky!!! Go Walt Go!!!!
John of Muncie, there’s a lot of truth in what you say about players taking a nap after signimg lucrative long-term contracts.
That’s just more evidence that baseball players are smarter than baseball owners.
you aren’t going to replace dunn’s offense with less money than what he’s getting.
there’s no one ready for next year in the farm system. griffey will be gone. what are we gonna do, use bruce and hairston and votto and play alonso at first? that’s a scary thought – but not to the other team. there is no option but to resign dunn.
sometimes i think some baseball fans are so busy thinking about the future that they forget there is a present to be played. what’s it matter if you have good young talent if you just trade it all away before it gets to expensive?
Dunn is 27. It’s not like re-signing Larkin 37.
Dunn has shown no sign of losing his offensive consistency and I don’t care if he’s a bad defensive LF (though I don’t think he’s as bad as others do).
This team is losing Griffey’s salary this off-season (other than the deferred stuff), and their quality young players are all young enough the team dictates their salary.
Signing Dunn to a 4 year deal makes sense. If the Reds had Billy Beane as a GM, you might be able to convince me to let him walk. But the money is there and he’s worth it.
If you don’t want to re-sign him, explain where the offense you lose is going to come from? Come on Doug, 3 years – $13M…that Corey Patterson money, that’s just silly.
If you allow the best offensive player on the team to walk…IMO, you’ve agreed that you can’t compete and are just going to be a farm team for the big payroll teams.