The problem is, who do they bring up? Put Homer Bailey in the bullpen? Bring Gary Majewski and his 7 ERA back? The relief pitching is so bad, they will no doubt bring him, Bray and Guardado back too soon. Guardado will not be the same even when he is healthy, so there still won’t be a closer, and they can’t make a trade for a good reliever, because nobody will trade for anyone in the lineup save Hamilton since no one has any plate discipline.
It’s extremely frustrating because the starting pitching has been so good. Minnesota would have handed Lohse millions if he’d pitched for them the way he did tonight.
I say some of us pull our money and take out an ad in the Post either A. Begging Krivsky to do something or B. Hold open tryouts for anybody in Cincinnati who can pitch (eephus pitchers would be welcome).
Or C, do something about the one constant over the past two seasons, Tome Hume. I don’t know what the exact role of the bullpen coach may be but when several relievers can’t get the job done I point my finger at him.
Hey, let me pitch. I could walk Berkman, I look similar to Weathers, Stanton, and Coffey; and I’m only 39 so I would drive the average age in the ‘pen down! I could run (part way) out to the mound. I can spit sunflower seeds. I could throw BP. It would be a dream come true for me. If we can’t get a decent bullpen together I say let the fans participate. I would root harder for John Q. Public on the mound than I would for these guys right now; and I certainly would not get upset when the opposing team put a couple in the bleachers. Put me in Coach…..
With the current management? Probably until just before the trade deadline, when all of the offense except Griffey, Dunn and Freel (and this time maybe Hamilton) are traded away.
todd coffey is having a terrible year so far, but last night i saw javy call a change up and said “what the hell? no no no!” and then the ball was in the stands. coffey hit his spot too.
valentin’s catcher ERA is 5.01 right now, and over the three years previous it’s been 5.18, 4.92, and 5.51, so there’s really no reason to think it’s going to get better. he’s also thrown out 0% of basestealers.
ross has sucked this year too, but his catcher ERA is 3.67 and he’s thrown out 54.5% of runners.
i don’t know who calls the pitches exactly, but i think we have to assume that we’re going to lose most games that javy catches. giving up 5 runs per game, like last night, is what he’s going to give you.
They were talking on the tv broadcast about Pole (I think) getting on Coffey for not throwing a pitch he had confidence in. He’s a fastball pitcher, to lose a game on a change up (probably his 3rd best pitch) is a crime.
Good article at Rosecrans about bullpen usage. If Coffey has been used too much, then wouldn’t sending him to AAA to work things out be self-defeating? Also regarding the Java Man I keep hearing Brantly and others talk about how much confidence he has in all his pitches, but rarely do I see him mix anything up. The only change up I saw yesterday was that piece of cheese he threw down the middle that ended up being the game breaker. He’s scared to throw the slider/split finger/whatever he calls it with runners in scoring position, particularly on third for fear of a wild pitch/passed ball, and I think with as much as he is used, including warming up, his heater is not as effective. When runners are on he is basically one dimensional and that won’t cut it at this level. I think there is a combination of confidence and usage issues happening here. Same way with Stanton. He will take the ball every time you put it in his hands and tell you that he feels great everytime out. That’s his makeup, always has been. But he’s 40 and working him every night in the week is just a bad idea, and that really should be obvious. You would think that Hume of all people would know this. His career was derailed for the same reason. Even on the nights he didn’t pitch he was in the bullpen throwing like he was coming in any moment. The ‘pen just isn’t set up to be used like it is. Add a Shields or a Linebrink and maybe you could get away with it. Have a dominant closer and perhaps you could stretch your starters one more inning, but none of those things are in place and you can’t pretend they are.
You sound exactly like my godfather, who swears every year (at age 55+) that he could be every bit as effective as these guys. And he’s left-handed – always looking for those guys.
He uses the Pete Rose line circa 1987-1988: “I’m ready if the team needs me.”
If Coffey doesn’t have confidence in what he is throwing then why is he in game deciding situation? Narron needs to go with people who are being successful. If Coffey wants to pitch then he will have to show it in mop up roles.
OK, in the spirit of knee-jerk reactions to fixing the bullpen (not that this organization would ever do that), let’s play ‘make a quick trade’. Reports are the Angels are interested in EE. Trade EE for Scott Shields and a solid prospect, any position. DFA or option someone in the bullpen, bring up Keppinger and have him split time with Freel at third mixing in a little TSF. Have some sort of plan to your bullpen use, say:
-Saarloos/Santos when you need a long man (3rd- 5th inning or better and spot starter)
We will trade Josh Hamilton for some relievers. Hamilton will go on to be remembered as one of the greatest to ever play. We’ll have a couple poor relievers.
2009 stats: Sarasota 2-1 8 Games 8 Games Started 42.1 IP 4.89 ERA 1.44 WHIP
Carolina 3-2 6 Game 6 Game Started 36 2/3 IP 2.95 ERA 1.09 WHIP
Louisville 2-2 5 Game 5 Game Started 29 IP 2.48 ERA 1.21 WHIP
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The problem is, who do they bring up? Put Homer Bailey in the bullpen? Bring Gary Majewski and his 7 ERA back? The relief pitching is so bad, they will no doubt bring him, Bray and Guardado back too soon. Guardado will not be the same even when he is healthy, so there still won’t be a closer, and they can’t make a trade for a good reliever, because nobody will trade for anyone in the lineup save Hamilton since no one has any plate discipline.
It’s extremely frustrating because the starting pitching has been so good. Minnesota would have handed Lohse millions if he’d pitched for them the way he did tonight.
I say some of us pull our money and take out an ad in the Post either A. Begging Krivsky to do something or B. Hold open tryouts for anybody in Cincinnati who can pitch (eephus pitchers would be welcome).
Or C, do something about the one constant over the past two seasons, Tome Hume. I don’t know what the exact role of the bullpen coach may be but when several relievers can’t get the job done I point my finger at him.
Hey, let me pitch. I could walk Berkman, I look similar to Weathers, Stanton, and Coffey; and I’m only 39 so I would drive the average age in the ‘pen down! I could run (part way) out to the mound. I can spit sunflower seeds. I could throw BP. It would be a dream come true for me. If we can’t get a decent bullpen together I say let the fans participate. I would root harder for John Q. Public on the mound than I would for these guys right now; and I certainly would not get upset when the opposing team put a couple in the bleachers. Put me in Coach…..
How long is this going to keep up before someone in managment does something about this?
With the current management? Probably until just before the trade deadline, when all of the offense except Griffey, Dunn and Freel (and this time maybe Hamilton) are traded away.
todd coffey is having a terrible year so far, but last night i saw javy call a change up and said “what the hell? no no no!” and then the ball was in the stands. coffey hit his spot too.
valentin’s catcher ERA is 5.01 right now, and over the three years previous it’s been 5.18, 4.92, and 5.51, so there’s really no reason to think it’s going to get better. he’s also thrown out 0% of basestealers.
ross has sucked this year too, but his catcher ERA is 3.67 and he’s thrown out 54.5% of runners.
i don’t know who calls the pitches exactly, but i think we have to assume that we’re going to lose most games that javy catches. giving up 5 runs per game, like last night, is what he’s going to give you.
They were talking on the tv broadcast about Pole (I think) getting on Coffey for not throwing a pitch he had confidence in. He’s a fastball pitcher, to lose a game on a change up (probably his 3rd best pitch) is a crime.
time to jettison more pieces of this bull pen and get Bray up here.
You can’t blame this on Valentin. Ross gets to catch Arroyo and Harang. LLM gets Milton. No wonder their CERA is different.
Good article at Rosecrans about bullpen usage. If Coffey has been used too much, then wouldn’t sending him to AAA to work things out be self-defeating? Also regarding the Java Man I keep hearing Brantly and others talk about how much confidence he has in all his pitches, but rarely do I see him mix anything up. The only change up I saw yesterday was that piece of cheese he threw down the middle that ended up being the game breaker. He’s scared to throw the slider/split finger/whatever he calls it with runners in scoring position, particularly on third for fear of a wild pitch/passed ball, and I think with as much as he is used, including warming up, his heater is not as effective. When runners are on he is basically one dimensional and that won’t cut it at this level. I think there is a combination of confidence and usage issues happening here. Same way with Stanton. He will take the ball every time you put it in his hands and tell you that he feels great everytime out. That’s his makeup, always has been. But he’s 40 and working him every night in the week is just a bad idea, and that really should be obvious. You would think that Hume of all people would know this. His career was derailed for the same reason. Even on the nights he didn’t pitch he was in the bullpen throwing like he was coming in any moment. The ‘pen just isn’t set up to be used like it is. Add a Shields or a Linebrink and maybe you could get away with it. Have a dominant closer and perhaps you could stretch your starters one more inning, but none of those things are in place and you can’t pretend they are.
That link was hilarious…
Hey, let me pitch. –preach
You sound exactly like my godfather, who swears every year (at age 55+) that he could be every bit as effective as these guys. And he’s left-handed – always looking for those guys.
He uses the Pete Rose line circa 1987-1988: “I’m ready if the team needs me.”
obviously CERA is very depended on the pitchers, but javy’s got a history of being pretty bad, and he’s caught Lohse this year.
like i said, there’s plenty of blame to go around, but that was a terrible pitch to call in that situation.
Agreed. But Coffey should’ve had the brains to shake it off. I say he’s ultimately responsible for what comes out of his hand.
And that is a great discussion over at Trent’s, started by old friend David Short.
I know people are begging Krivsky to do something about the bullpen, but am I the only one scared to death about what he might do?
If Coffey doesn’t have confidence in what he is throwing then why is he in game deciding situation? Narron needs to go with people who are being successful. If Coffey wants to pitch then he will have to show it in mop up roles.
OK, in the spirit of knee-jerk reactions to fixing the bullpen (not that this organization would ever do that), let’s play ‘make a quick trade’. Reports are the Angels are interested in EE. Trade EE for Scott Shields and a solid prospect, any position. DFA or option someone in the bullpen, bring up Keppinger and have him split time with Freel at third mixing in a little TSF. Have some sort of plan to your bullpen use, say:
-Saarloos/Santos when you need a long man (3rd- 5th inning or better and spot starter)
-Shields every eighth inning regardless of lineup
-Everyone else depending on matchups.
Any other quick fix suggestions?
We will trade Josh Hamilton for some relievers. Hamilton will go on to be remembered as one of the greatest to ever play. We’ll have a couple poor relievers.
NOooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo